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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I am thinking about getting into service rifle competition and would like to here some opinions on either rifle for this application. What are the pros and cons of of the .308 and the .223 and both rifle designs? I am thinking about a Bushmaster DCM or Springfield match m1A.


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"A flute without any holes isn't really a flute and a donut without a hole is a danish." Ty Webb

[This message has been edited by Denbo (edited 11-18-2001).]
 

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I've shot both in High Power competition and for me it's really a toss up in terms of how well I shoot. Most of the high end shooters have switched to the AR15 because it's inherent accuracy is supposedly better. I find the AR15 to be very finicky with magazines, ammo and various other mechanical problems. I think I've experienced them all. Not a match goes by that someone doesn't have some sort of a problem with an AR. I ultimately switched to an M1A Super Match and am very happy. I have not had a single problem, I'm shooting better than ever and the .30 caliber hole helps in the scoreing. I find most new shooters are better off with a reliable gun so they can concentrate on their skills.
Good luck
Hans
 

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Dear Denbo, In any kind of wind the much heavier .308 bullet is going to stay on course substantially better than the .223. Stay safe, Gary

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My hands-down favorite is the M1A, but to be completely fair about it, I think you'll be happier in the long run with an AR-15.

If you look at current trends, in terms of who is winning matches with what equipment, I think the case for the AR is a strong one, indeed.

No, the .223 is never going to be the ballistic equal of the .308, and there is no valid substitute for the "experience" of firing an M1A; notwithstanding, I think that all available evidence suggests that the future of service competition shooting lies with the AR -- not the venerable .30.

Chuck
 

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Without any doubt whatsoever, an AR. Easier to shoot, cheaper to shoot, easier to maintain, and easier to win with.

I shot Sierra 80's across the course for two seasons. The 223 is beating the 308 at all ranges. Compare the bc of a 80 MK to a 175.

Shooting the 223 in the rapids is almost like cheating compared to the M-1A.

Once the JLK 90's get figured out, you will see AR's beating M-1A's at 1000.

The biggest and only plus of the M-1A is sight radius.

Good luck to you.

Tom
AF Shooting Team
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
Thanks for the help guys. Most of the guys at my club have recomended the Bushmaster DCM for an AR and, well, Springfield Super match for a M1a. Any thoughts?

Sidenote:

Are G.I. M-14's for sale to the public? I thought that only a few were made to be full auto and do not understand why they would not be for sale like Garands. Forgive me if this is really stupid question.

[This message has been edited by Denbo (edited 11-20-2001).]
 

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Are G.I. M-14's for sale to the public?
From what I understand, no, they aren't. In fact, I think that a huge number of M-14s were destroyed during the Clinton administration.
 

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This subject of the US M14 rifles ever coming up for sale also poped up on the yahoo board and Walt asked the people who know , which is what he always does. It works like this there were roughly 1.5 million M14 rifles produced between 1957 and 1963 bear in mind this is including tool room guns and prototypes. Rifles lost in combat were very few. However The rifles gave away to Armenia and Taiwan and God knows who else along with Slick Billy running several hundred thousand through captain crunch dwindled the number severly. The Navy and Marine Corp had 10,000 totaly refurbushied for sea duty, SEAL use and for the Marine Force Recon units. I am told the Army kept an additional 10,000 for their SF and Ranger requirments. I am told they gave away around 250,000 rifles to various countries. The legacy of Bill Clinton is going to haunt us for years to come. It is a bleak thing ,we must remember and not let it happen again .
 

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I agree under duress that the way of service rifle is the AR15 but that is only because the Military Rifle Teams are going to it in droves. It is a shame that we no longer have real men wanting to shoot a real rifle. The AR will never be able to shoot with an M1/M1A/M14. It is not pshysically possible. I own a Bushmaster DCM and it is a fine excellent rifle. and I must admit the wind bucking ability of the the 69-80 grain pills is much better than what was available. But it is not on par with 168-175 grain pills of the 30 cal. Also the recoil of of a fully match prepped M1a/M14 is very little. I can honestly say it takes skill to pick up an M1A and fire it accurately over the course of fire. I can not say the same of the AR as I have so many shoot it very well. A much lesser degree is required. They are still fun little rifles. But as long as I shoot service rifle Ill shoot 30 cal.
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
Thanks for that info!
 

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Originally posted by Denbo:
Thanks for that info!
The thing I can't get over with the AR-15 at long range (over 400 to 500 yards) is the use of bullets that make a service rifle into a single shot. This is not my idea of a *service* rifle.
 
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