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best da/sa 1911?

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it's been troubling me to find double action/single action 1911's. i know of para ordinance. but can anyone suggest any other companies/models that offer da/sa? thanks
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Nope. From everything I have read the Para design is the first sucessful DA/SA 1911 pattern design. From those that have them and like a D/A only pistol they report it is smooth as butter. Note the Para LDA has only one trigger pull.

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As far as I know the only DA/SA 1911 was the Seecamp conversion of a standard Government Model. It's been twenty-five or more years since these were popular, but they show up occasionally at gun shows and on the 'net. An alternative, though not a true 1911 due to the differences in grip shape, is the Colt Double Eagle. Everyone, except the people who actually have them, think they're junk. They can be found on the various auction sites in the $500-$700 range, depending on barrel length (3.5", 4.25", 5"), caliber (.40, 10mm, .45) and condition. I'd love to have a .40 Commander.
I tried an early LDA, and thought the trigger felt like squeezing a pin cushion (the ones filled with lead shot); maybe they're better now.
 

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I love my Double Eagle Commender...more

It was my first 45 and I have shot a lot of IDPA with it. Somewhat like a Sig, it has a decocker and no safty. Matter of fact, yesterday saw an even smaller one (Double Eagle) and boy was I tempted.

It was my "carry 45" for a long time until I got a Kimber BP10 II commander. While it is a straight SA, it holds 13+1 which I really like.

For a long time...several years...I shot 9mm variants of the CZ75B. I have used this gun for lots of carry (2075) and did most all my IDPA with a 75B. Unless it just HAS to be 45, consider CZ's in 9mm or 40's too (I think)

I realize my experience with the DZ is not what you asked...about DA/SA 45's. If I HAD to get a DA/SA now I would either get a SIG or another Double eagle. Another way I refer to Double Eagle is that I am willing to modify sights, cutting dovetails and I dont worry about it's effect on value because this gun "has already been collected" and it's never going anywhere. Sort of interesting that my brother who is a far superior shooter, has made me promise that is I sell it, he gets first chance at it.

Rgds
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anthro said:
thanks for your posts guys, more opinions would be appreciated. i'm just wondering why the 1911 companies don't try to produce da's. to me they are absolutly nessicary in self defensive.
Why? If you know waht you are doing, a standard 1911 is perfect for defense. What is the point in trying to turn a great design into something that it is not? There are plenty of DA designs from SIG, S&W, and dozens of others.

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ranburr said:
Why? If you know waht you are doing, a standard 1911 is perfect for defense. What is the point in trying to turn a great design into something that it is not? There are plenty of DA designs from SIG, S&W, and dozens of others.

ranburr
I agree!
The 1911 trigger system is one of the fastest fire control design available. Its perfect for SD, given that one is properly trained for its design (read, familiar). The faster you can get the bullet on your target, the better the outcome (in SD or in competition). I don't see the point of deviating from that design in a 1911 platform. But of course, to each, his own.
If you want a "1911 like" handgun, but with a DA feature, I recommend Para LDA's, SIG 220 and H&K USP.
 

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I kind of think that if it is DA/SA it can not be a 1911 even if looks like one. See my signature. :) :) :p
 

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JimV

But you are to stuck in yours ways. LOL If JMB could have designed the 1911 like the Para LDA I suspect he would have. May have had no need for the grip safety then.

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I have a friend who had a Para LDA that I shot, and I didn't like the DA trigger pull. It was his first 1911, and he quickly sold it. I can't agree that a DA pistol is necessary for self-defense, because, for one reason, I have never met anyone familiar with single-action 1911s who shot better with a DA Para than he or she did with a single-action 1911. If the ultimate remedy in self-defense is removing the threat of an attacker before the attacker kills or inflicts serious harm on you or someone that you are protecting, than why wouldn't you want the pistol that you would shoot better with and have a better chance of hitting your target? If you are primarily concerned about trigger pull weight, you can increase the trigger pull. Otherwise, the thumb safety and grip safety seem sufficent. I have a Glock 23 and a Kahr PM9 without any manual safeties. Merely pulling the trigger discharges either pistol, and I am more comfortable carrying a single-action 1911, regardless of whether or not the particular 1911 has a firing-pin safety.
 

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1911.45

FYI the fear with S/A is the triggers can be set very low and in heavily charged environments that LEO's find themselves in from time to time the possibility of an accicental discharge is great. The LDA solves that to some extent with the longer trigger pull. The RCMP switched to the S&W pistol in D/A for that reason PLUS the S&W has a trigger pull very similar to a revolver. The latter made training transitional officers much easier when they moved from their Model 10 .39spl.

The RCMP guns take a bit to get used to but are quite adeqate for the job and I can tell yo ustraight some of the young men in red can shoot. I understand their ERT teams are going to the Sig in 9MM.
 

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I've said this before but it never ceases to amaze me at the speed at which some people will attack Para as a company.

The LDA has been repeatedly described as being probably the best DAO on the market by a great number of people that have made their livelihood from and around firearms. Yet, some would condemn it because it looks like the 1911. What does that have to do with anything?

The person that started this thread asked a very intelligent question which was based on the fact that he likes the 1911 for all of its attributes (need I list them here?) but would still prefer to go DA/SA or maybe even DAO.

Immediately the negative responses started to fly as if this was something that had to be stamped out in case this forum's members would start to view Para as the great innovating company that it is. Yes, that is for all those that constantly praise companies that have copied the 1911 and all they have done is pin-stripe it. High-capacity .45ACP once thought undoable, a 1911 based DAO also thought to be impossible to do without external gear shafts and an internal (not external for someof its models only) Power extractor, were all the innovations of Para. Yes, that is correct, PARA.

I ask you? How does one compare some gunsmith's, slap-on, external mechanism that only the blind don't mind having on their gun to a new trigger action that has been successfully marketed for some years now with accolade and awards, and will probably be one of the front-runner entries in the new Army solicitation for a .45ACP pistol? How is that possible?

How does it make sense that if one wants a DAO pistol it cannot look like a 1911 even if the specific offering, the LDA, may very well be the best DAO the market has to offer? Or is everyone here that owns a 1911 sworn never to buy a psitol with a different action system like a Glock, H&K, Sig etc...

I must say some of the posts against Para just srtrike me as inexplicable, weird, of questionable motive or intent and other things that I won't bother to add.

Hopefully, all critics will accept another's honest critique. I'd certainly like to see other Para supporters come out of the woodwork and express yourselves about how you feel.

Let me finish by saying that I've never seen regular Para cotributors so readily demean other companies' products and that is why I don't understand why it happens to Para.
 

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Lighten up, Francis:

DINO1 said:
I've said this before but it never ceases to amaze me at the speed at which some people will attack Para as a company.

The LDA has been repeatedly described as being probably the best DAO on the market by a great number of people that have made their livelihood from and around firearms. Yet, some would condemn it because it looks like the 1911. What does that have to do with anything?

The person that started this thread asked a very intelligent question which was based on the fact that he likes the 1911 for all of its attributes (need I list them here?) but would still prefer to go DA/SA or maybe even DAO.

Immediately the negative responses started to fly as if this was something that had to be stamped out in case this forum's members would start to view Para as the great innovating company that it is. Yes, that is for all those that constantly praise companies that have copied the 1911 and all they have done is pin-stripe it. High-capacity .45ACP once thought undoable, a 1911 based DAO also thought to be impossible to do without external gear shafts and an internal (not external for someof its models only) Power extractor, were all the innovations of Para. Yes, that is correct, PARA.

I ask you? How does one compare some gunsmith's, slap-on, external mechanism that only the blind don't mind having on their gun to a new trigger action that has been successfully marketed for some years now with accolade and awards, and will probably be one of the front-runner entries in the new Army solicitation for a .45ACP pistol? How is that possible?

How does it make sense that if one wants a DAO pistol it cannot look like a 1911 even if the specific offering, the LDA, may very well be the best DAO the market has to offer? Or is everyone here that owns a 1911 sworn never to buy a psitol with a different action system like a Glock, H&K, Sig etc...

I must say some of the posts against Para just srtrike me as inexplicable, weird, of questionable motive or intent and other things that I won't bother to add.

Hopefully, all critics will accept another's honest critique. I'd certainly like to see other Para supporters come out of the woodwork and express yourselves about how you feel.

Let me finish by saying that I've never seen regular Para cotributors so readily demean other companies' products and that is why I don't understand why it happens to Para.
I just twice read all the above post and I do not see ONE slam against Para. I see people who do not like the DA/SA trigger in a 1911. There is a difference.

Relax and read it all again.

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Art
 

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"There is a difference"

With respect, not when the only sucessful D/A trigger using the 1911 format is Para. In fact the LDA system is not D/A but really just a S/A with a difference. It allows for hammer down carry which is the only way it can be carried with a round in the chamber. The longer trigger pull, though smooth, is a good safe guard against accidental firing in stress situations. While named "Lght Double Action" or LDA the fact is there is only one trigger pull which in my mind makes is a S/A gun. Having one trigger pull has it's advantages as we all can attest to.

Come to thinkof it the S&W 5946 the RCMP is described as a D/A pistol but has only one trigger pull - now if anyone wants to know about long heavy trigger pull try the 5946.
 

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robertblank:

That may be your take on this, but not mine.

In any event, just as this forum will not tolerate Mfg bashing, neither will it allow a member to bash others because of their opinions when they conflict with his.

Let's get this thread back on topic.

Take care,
Art
 

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You don't need a DA/SA or even DAO for self defense if you intend to train (as you should) with the weapon. IF you don't want to train, I'd rethink the idea of buying a gun. But if you must, you would be hard pressed to find something better than a Ruger or SW double action revolver.

The "fear" that some people have of SA designed weapons is usually grounded in ignorance. If you truly understand how the weapon is to function, how to deploy/employ and you actually spend some time training with the SA weapon then you will lose your fear of it and actually end up with a superior platform.

The DA/SA and DA actually increase the probability that you won't hit what you are aiming at...and isn't that the intent anyway? To hit what you are aiming at?
 

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anthro said:
it's been troubling me to find double action/single action 1911's. i know of para ordinance. but can anyone suggest any other companies/models that offer da/sa? thanks
I simply don't understand the posts that followed mine with their comments about getting the thread back on-line, about whether or not single action is better than DA/SA and also something about bashing others. Or maybe I do, despite everyone's efforts to the contrary.

The thread was started by someone looking for any "1911 DA/SA" other than Para. I will not debate what the LDA action is but it is my understanding that ATF has classified it as DAO.

Anthro never asked whether he should buy a Para, whether Para's action is better than a single action, whether it's trigger feels like a cushion or what gives you a better chance of hitting your target.

So I really do not know who has gone off-topic.

To answer the original question, and I apologize if I didn't do so in my earlier post, there is no other company other than Para, much to this Canadian company's credit, that has had the engineering know-how to offer a 1911-platform pistol in anything other than single action. This directly responds to Anthro's question, irrespective of how irritating it may be for some to come to terms with the truth of it.
 

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The Para really is not a 1911. It shares many of the same parts. But, it also has a significant number of parts that differ, not to mention the butchering of the slide rail. I personally would not want the Para unless I was forced to carry a DA pistol. I own a Para LTC which is a pretty good gun and really is a 1911 (commander sized). In a nutshell, there are no DA 1911s. When you change the trigger and the action, it ceases to be a 1911.

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Discussion Starter · #19 ·
i take back my question. i'm sorry. i have never shot a single action pistol and never really understood what s/a meant. from what i have learned now, all you have to do is cock the trigger once and thats it....from my own sense i thought u had to cock it after every shot.....which could still be the truth....someone please correct or affirm me on this. if you only have to cock it once....then this is the best action for SD to me then. the short trigger pull is also good. i am still confused, i admit i am a n00b when it comes to pistols. now i'm trying to understand...what is the benefit of a DA?
 

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Single action revolvers require the hammer to be cocked by hand for each shot. Single asction pistols, like the 1911 or a Colt 1903, require the hammer to be cocked manually for the first shot, after that the recoiling slide will cock the hammer.
 
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