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Discussion Starter #1
In the market for a new 5" 9X23 1911. Anybody here know of some good 5" 9mm candidates to ream out to 9X23? Fully Supported Chamber, etc.? Any recomendations for a smith who does good chamber\ream work?

Yes, yes, I know I could buy a custom already in 9X23, but I'm looking to spend about $1k on the stock piece and then a little more for the conversion.
 

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Pistolsmith Dane Burns, in Issaquah, WA, is a big 9x23 advocate. You might inquire with him. The 9x23 does not require a ramped barrel, as the case was designed to work with a standard barrel/frame configuration; that broadens your options, some.
 

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The Springfield Loaded (9x19) or Colt (38 Super) would probably be the two best production candidates. If you could locate one, I'd also say the Dan Wesson PM-9 would be a good choice but that was a very small production model. I love the 9x23 Win. and went the custom route for mine. I went with a ramped barrel, although that is certainly not necessary.
 

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Might consider ending up with a switch barrel gun at today's prices.

Might consider ending up with a switch barrel gun at today's prices. That is buy a 9X19 and add a 9X23 barrel. Consider also a .38 Auto and add a 9X23 as well as a 9X19 barrel.

Notice that traditionally there have been 2 reamer designs for the 9X23 - a larger - but only very slightly - reamer to clean up existing chambers, especially .38 Super chambers and a smaller, but only very slightly, to use when not cleaning up oversize chambers. See e.g. Layne Simpson's book on the custom 1911 as originally published by Wolfe.

Whether to use a ramped full support barrel will depend to some extent on the intended use. For a carry gun with factory ammunition, either Silvertip or CorBon there is no need for a ramped barrel - for some varieties of game guns a ramped barrel may be preferred.

My own carry gun, from Dane Burns, has a ramped barrel but that's because it was a .38 Super conversion on a nice Kimber which shipped with a ramp - not because a ramped barrel has any advantage for my own purposes. For pure defense purposes a conventional barrel is preferable I think.
 

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9x23 feeds fine in a standard or supported chamber, like the others noted.
A supported "ramped" barrel is not necessary in factory loaded 9x23.

If I were ever going to reload 9x23 or .38 super I would lean towards a ramped barrel.

You don't want weakened, reloaded brass or a potential double charge and an unsupported chamber.
 

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Discussion Starter #6
Thanks guys, do the Colt or Springer have fully supported barrels?
 

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Thanks guys, do the Colt or Springer have fully supported barrels?
No.

Another gun to look at is the STI Trojan, a lot of gun for the money, in my opinion much better than Springfield and Colt. Better sights, no sharp edges like the other two, factory scalloped front strap, beavertail grip safety and extended safety (Colt and Springfield Milspec don't), better trigger out of the box, very accurate and reliable.
 

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Discussion Starter #8
Which is a better candidate for 9X23: 9X19 barrels or .38 Super?
 

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The 9x23 is an extremely high pressure round. I would only use a original 9x23 barrel. Better safe than sorry.
 

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The 9x23 is an extremely high pressure round. I would only use a original 9x23 barrel. Better safe than sorry.
Whats unsafe about using a 9mm barrel reamed or a Super barrel for that matter? All my favorite pistolsmiths must be wrong..
 

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? maybe confusion between mixing cartridges across chambers?

? maybe confusion between mixing cartridges across chambers and rechambering?

Some users report headspacing on the extractor and mixing cartridges in the same chamber - something I avoid - although of course many 1911 cartridges do seem to headspace on the extractor given that most .45 Auto brass say is noticably shorter than the chamber.

When 9mm Largo pistols from Europe were common and marked 9mm38 there was talk about mixing cartridges and some do it today. I mostly don't or switch barrels rather than just cartridges.

My own carry gun is a rechambered .38 Auto from an experienced smith. For a carry gun the slightly larger chamber made necessary by cleaning up the .38 Auto chamber suits me - this is a pistol I might take to war so to speak. I have a couple Service Ace conversions and a Wilson game gun for cheaper practice on the 1911 platform.

For a game gun where I wanted to get as much use as possible from the expensive brass I might prefer a tighter chamber and dies that work the brass as little as possible. For the tightest possible chamber I might start with a 9X19 and consider that a short chambered barrel for gunsmith fitting.

Notice too the 9X23 - which has no SAAMI specifications - is normally long throated much in the same manner as Weatherby freebore and for similar reasons.
 

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Discussion Starter #12
Thanks Clark, I will be using this for range work mostly and will be reloading for it - will probably go with a Trojan 9mm (unless they'll make me one in 9X23).
 

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Whats unsafe about using a 9mm barrel reamed or a Super barrel for that matter? All my favorite pistolsmiths must be wrong..
There are a lot of 9mm barrels on the market and some can't be trusted to take the pressure of the 9x23. I bought a 9mm 1911 barrel from Numrich last year that was cast. I'm sure when a gunsmith recommends this procedure they have a specific, high quality barrel in mind.

PS I wouldn't use full power 9x23 in a stock Colt Super barrel. One of the reasons for marketing this round as the 9x23 rather than a beefed up Super is so that people wouldn't fire it in a Colt Super barrel.
 

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PS-You don't know what you are talking about. I have had several discussions with John Ricco about this in detail.
 

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There are a lot of 9mm barrels on the market and some can't be trusted to take the pressure of the 9x23. I bought a 9mm 1911 barrel from Numrich last year that was cast. I'm sure when a gunsmith recommends this procedure they have a specific, high quality barrel in mind.

PS I wouldn't use full power 9x23 in a stock Colt Super barrel. One of the reasons for marketing this round as the 9x23 rather than a beefed up Super is so that people wouldn't fire it in a Colt Super barrel.

I wouln't run +p 9mm through a CAST barrel...

9mm +P has a SAAMI pressure ceiling of 38,500 psi. There’s no SAAMI spec for 9mm +P+; that’s just a way of saying its pressures exceed +P standards, so 9mm +P+, a typical LE load is pretty close in pressure to 9x23 which run about 42K.

The 9x23 was DESIGNED to be fired in an unaltered or lightly altered .38 Super pistol to eliminate case head blowouts with major loads and improve feeding out of a double column magazine. In many chambers, the round drops in. If your Super chamber was cut withn old, worn reamer a light reaming will be required. This is all by design. If Ricco didn't want it be fired in a Super, he would have made a 9x23 or 9x25, like a 10mm case. Short enough to feed in a 1911, but will not fit in a Super chamber. That was not the goal.

Colt shipped 9x23 guns with 9x23 barrels with 9x23 chambers. That was not the designers intent. That was Colt and Winchester's intent. That was most certainly lawyer and/or marketing driven and one reason the cartrdige has died on the vine.
 

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That depends ........

If you want to retain the ability to shoot 9mm, then you would need a second barrel in 9x23. If not, your 9mm barrel could be reamed out to 9x23.

You'd also need a stronger recoil spring and an appropriate magazine; I think that Super .38 magazines will work for you. SA added a firing pin bushing to your slide in their factory conversions.

The pistolsmith.com forum has a 9x23 page.

Good shopping!
 

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Your ejector may have to be trimmed also.
 
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