1911Forum banner

Difference between a ca. 1951 and a ca. 1967?

2K views 25 replies 12 participants last post by  Georgiadave 
#1 ·
I'm looking to buy a Colt 1911 and there are two to choose from locally - a 1951 in about 92% and a 1967 in about 98% condition. The 1951 is $150 more money - why? - all else is pretty much equal. Which is the better deal? Thanks!

John
 
#2 ·
There has to be something wrong with the '67 that you didn't pick up on. They're nearly identical guns, and the shop would be fools to charge more for the one with less finish otherwise.
 
#4 ·
Assuming they were both steel Gov. models it is still something I have seen. In the last year or so the older guns are starting to go up in price; sometimes a lot. If the shop owners are not new they may have a feel for what they can sell a given gun for in their area despite blue book lists etc. The next question is do you want a shooter, and how much are you going to shoot it?
 
#5 ·
I'm seeing early 50's guns bringing in higher prices lately. I don't know why other than on the auctions, they are C&R and that may broaden the market - just a theory. The finishes were the same during the 50's and 60's, hot salt blue vs. over blue for pre-war guns. I think the prewar guns are nicer when you can find one in great condition but the prices go into the stratosphere. I guess that will happen to the ones made after the war too.
 
#6 ·
I appreciate the replies. I guess I should have mentioned these are located in two different stores many miles apart. I don't think I missed anything on the '67 - accept that it is by serial number a 66!!!! (Sorry, I should check these things before posting).

Both are Govt. models. Both have nice, but replacement grips. Both have those HUGE and incredibly ugly, yet functional, Bomar (sp.?) type target sights that will have to be dealt with. Why did people put these things on - I've seen a lot of older Colts with these installed - were they factory added? Well, they ruin the look IMHO. Can they be easily removed?

The '66 is $780 and the '51 is $935. Neither store is negotiating at this time.

Thanks!

John
 
#7 ·
It's possible that one or both of the guns are consignment guns, not store owned, and placed out for sale by the owner who wants to make a certain amount from the sale.

You can always make an offer.

If the Bomar rear sights are the adjustable type and low mounted it's likely the slides have been machined to fit them. Take a look at that and figure that if metal has been removed it will cost a bit to place another type of sight there. It's much easier to replace a sight that uses the standard Colt dovetail. You may want to weigh the cost of this versus getting a newer gun and doing that up, over time, the way you'd like it.

tipoc
 
#11 ·
Thanks for replying. I take it putting on Bomar sights modifies the slide? The dovetail has to be larger? Couldn't really see if it was larger or not. Replacing the grips and putting on sights doesn't seem much of a modification to me. Also, they are easily rectified.

As far as "maybe I should get a new gun" - I like the old ones better - I don't have a reason but I do. Both have that pretty Colt blue that the newer guns just don't have.

As far as "$500 tops" for a pre-70 series, "modified" - please direct me to some in this condition for this price - I'll take three.

Thanks for the help!

John
 
#12 ·
The back of the slide is milled down for Bomars.


It's your money:biglaugh: but I try not to buy used guns that have had some gunmonkey's hands on them. Too many things could have been done to the slide and frame that make them unusable. And I hate to buy a gun and then replace parts because someone was file/dremel happy. $900+ for a pistol + new parts + gunsmith + shipping = way too much money invested in a common shooter.

But we all have to work out our own salvation.
 
#13 ·
Well I'm of a different mind than Bill I guess. If the work is quality work than the prices that you mentioned are not too much so long as the alterations are ones that you want or that can be changed easily for your needs. If the gun has had a good trigger job, the ramp correctly polished, etc. than that's money you may not have to spend later.

Bomar low mount rear sights are some of the best adjustable sights on the market. They do require milling out the rear of the slide for proper installation. Replacing them with another set may be pricey so that's a factor to consider.

If they are another type of sight that is just in a dove tail than they are easily replaced. Replacing the stocks is nothing.

So ask the shops to hold them for a day for you and look them over closely. Your call. But guns from the 60s and 70s are not so uncommon that you can't find good clean examples in the same price range.

tipoc
 
#16 ·
That was the standard Bomar installation for G.I. match and bullseye guns. The problem is more likely going to be the front sight, as a very tall replacement must be fitted, and sometimes you will find the sight attached in a non-standard way (welded, or the hole for the tenon cut oversize). It's possible that the guns are set up specifically for bullseye competition, and that the only visible mods are the sights. You could find that they have hand-fitted barrels, triggers, etc., and if they are good shooters, they are going to be priced higher than a gun that has merely been "messed with". Those prices could then seem pretty reasonable.
 
#17 ·
Be sure which Bomars are there. Some did not have to be "hacked in" and others did. Bomar made and still makes many sights. There is an older 1970 Gold Cup in a gunstore I go to every now and again for $600. It has a Bomar on the rear that was hacked in (Meaning metal was removed from the slide and you do not easily, and never cheaply, ever go back.) and nobody has bought it in a year.

Other readers also have a good point. If a person or some "smith" put the Bomar sight on, what else did they do?

I would have to look at these in person and have a 90 return policy before I would think of buying (Have a good gunsmith lined up to evaluate them). From the information on the thread, I would not even think of buying these and would keep on looking.
 
#18 ·
Bo-mar is not making any more sights. We may yet see more "Bo-mars" in the future, made under someone else's roof.
 
#20 ·
We might be getting to the bottom of the barrel at the local shops. On my 1911 gun hunts, I used to come across and buy some nice 50's-60's commercials, series 70's and honest WWII GI's rigs from time to time.

Nowadays, when my eye catches a nice old roll mark Colt in the display counter, it is usually accompanied by 'bomar' along with a welded on sight rail! :barf::biglaugh:
 
#21 ·
We might be getting to the bottom of the barrel at the local shops. On my 1911 gun hunts, I used to come across and buy some nice 50's-60's commercials, series 70's and honest WWII GI's rigs from time to time.
Same here. Once upon a time every gun shop had a used section with some really nice old Colts on occasion. Nowadays I rarely see any used guns for sale, and if I do, assuming any of them are 1911's it'll just be something somebody else screwed up. It seems many shops nowadays don't even take trade-ins, or if they do they sell them off online.
 
#22 ·
Unless you're dying for an old Bomar-sighted pistol a new pistol, even a new M1991 will probably be a better if less attractive choice.

But I consider my pistols to be tools and tools look like tools. I've never hard chrome plated a hammer or shovel or put an exotic wood handle on one. :biglaugh:

All depends on what you want. 40 and 50 year old Colts are becoming collectable in unaltered condition. Paying collector prices and then altering the pistol (with decent sights, for example) can make it worth less to many folks.

Good used M1991 won't cost you more than $400 and no one is collecting them in any condition. ;)





-- Chuck
 
#23 ·
Well, I went and did it. I stopped at a pawn shop on the way home and bought a 98% Norinco 1911 for $380 out the door. I can do whatever I want to this gun, carry it in the woods, shoot it 'til the cows come home and nobody will care. It has the old-school look that I was after. I still want one of the pre-70 Colts but I'll look around a bit more before I decide.

John
 
#26 ·
C Frame Colts

The post WWII Colts with a C prefix in the serial have a harder slide than later procduction. They are called hard slide guns, and many of the slides have been used to build target guns, as they maintain their accuracy longer. It is not uncommon to see a C frame with a later slide on it.

These guns are the highest quality 1911s that Colt made.
 
This is an older thread, you may not receive a response, and could be reviving an old thread. Please consider creating a new thread.
Top