I know the title may seem stupid since this is a 1911 forum, but I am beating my head against the wall with this problem and need help. I recently got back into guns and got my CCW. I first chose the S&W Sigma .40 but immediately got rid of it because the trigger was a piece of crap. I tried a Glock 17 and loved it so I bought a 19 (9mm). It was a good size and the recoil was next to nil. At the time, I only wanted to spend $500 for a carry pistol. Since then, I have bought an AK-47, Glock 34, an SA 1911 WWII and have a Taurus RB .44 on the way. I spent $610 (including tax) on the SS SA (at the time I thought it was a good deal). The sight/trigger job I am having done on it will cost $183, so after tax and all the SA will cost me $793. The more I read the more I begin to worry that 9mm, even HP, will not be effective in a confrontation. At first I didn't want to carry a 1911 because of the size, cost and having the disengage the safety (I like the Glock's lack of an external safety). My question is this: should I sell the Glock (for about $450?) and the SA 1911 (for about $600? and LOSE MY BUTT!) and buy a Para Ordinance LDA DAO 1911? Please give me your honest opinions. I do like Glock, so it's not a matter of 1911 vs. Glock. It's more about calibur and I don't want a Glock .45 due to the recoil. Thanks!
Glock 9mm vs. 1911-Which would you carry?
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MarkW
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I'd carry the one I could shoot the best.
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I agree with Mark 100%. The one that is the most reliable and you are the most proficient with... Period.
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No doubt... My old lady is a nurse and works the ER frequently... Ask any nurse, EMT, or LEO and you find plenty of homicides with .22's, .25's, and 9mm.... More than you think..Mus said:
Given the choice of course I prefer the .45, however 9mm can and will be an effective man stopper given proper shot placement.
It's been reported that Rob Leatham ( arguably the best single stack 45 shooter in the world ) carries a SA XD sub-compact in 9MM w/ +P ammo. He can carry anything and his quote was something to the extent- Good ammo in any caliber- shot placement is what counts. If you can't hit it, the only thing a 50BMG will do is make them deaf. Then they'll kill you . My .02 Tracy
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Keep both guns. Shoot them both a lot. Stoke the G19 with a good-expanding JHP and carry it with confidence. Shot placement is the most important factor.
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dito
Location - location - location ! Which can you shoot the best and which is the easiest for you to carry? Also,how often are you going to practice? The less you practice, the simplier the weapon you should carry (revolver or Glock) The less operations to get the gun in play or the less to do during a failure, the better you chances of survival in a confrontation (especially with little practice).
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I have a number of both (Glock 17's and 45 auto's), and love them both....... but I currently carry the Glock; for reliability, mag capacity, weight, and penetration reasons.
I'm with you on weight and mag capacity. But penetration issues and reliability? Are you making the argument that the .45 will not penetrate deep enough or that the 9 will penetrate more? That's contrary to every bit of research I've ever seen.Ronin45230 said:
I have both a Glock 19 and two 1911s. I carry the G19 in the summer because of the weight (it's just easier to carry around in light clothing) and because it is less likely to be suspetible to rust. My G19 has been more reliable than my 1911s, but those problems were always mag issues and once I fixed the problem mags, everything was cool. I feel more confident carrying .45 slugs than 9, so I carry the 1911 when I can.
Shot placement is A#1. IMHO - A#1.1 is that you *TEST* whatever ammo you are going to carry in the gun you are going to place it in.
Warning - possible minor rabbit trail ahead
I tell teach the classes I hold buy a box of defensive ammo (DA) and shoot 1/2 in your semi-auto. Dedicate the remainder to that gun. I would recommend this for every box of DA I bought for any gun I own. I do not care if they are two model Xs serial number 12345 and serial number 12346.
A reliable gun with reliable DA and the ability to use it effectively.
Note: For the 9mm I would NEVER use ball ammo unless I really really had to.
I took a 4" stack of newsprint and tied it in front of the backstop. I shot it with 38sp wad cutters, 9mm ball, and 45 acp truncated cone. The 38 went about 1/3 through, the 45 about 2/3. The 9mm drilled right through it. It really gave me a better perspective on over penetration!
Warning - possible minor rabbit trail ahead
I tell teach the classes I hold buy a box of defensive ammo (DA) and shoot 1/2 in your semi-auto. Dedicate the remainder to that gun. I would recommend this for every box of DA I bought for any gun I own. I do not care if they are two model Xs serial number 12345 and serial number 12346.
A reliable gun with reliable DA and the ability to use it effectively.
Note: For the 9mm I would NEVER use ball ammo unless I really really had to.
I took a 4" stack of newsprint and tied it in front of the backstop. I shot it with 38sp wad cutters, 9mm ball, and 45 acp truncated cone. The 38 went about 1/3 through, the 45 about 2/3. The 9mm drilled right through it. It really gave me a better perspective on over penetration!
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Well, I base my opinion on my experience. I'm one of those guys that feels penetration is second only to reliability (and would only use a handgun if didn't have access to something with more substantial penetrating ability....308, 223, or a 12ga).CTSA1911 said:
Actually, it all depends on the scenarios you are considering; if they involve having to penetrate car bodywork, windows, light structural cover, and/or multiple sophisticated adversaries that know how to use cover wisely (or may even wear protection)...... Follow? Now in an aircraft, or in a thin walled appartment against a punk wearng a T-shirt? that's a different story...
I carry Federal Bonded LE 135+P HP, backed up with Fed NATO 124 FMJ in my G17's. I also have Hirtenberger +P+ for extreme cases.
The 9mm Bonded Law Enforcement HP penetrates better than both the 40 and 45 (Fed LE Bonded HP). The Federal NATO M882 clocks ~ 1265 out of my G17 and defeats protection that'll stop 45 Ball. And the Hirtenberger FMJ? that stuff clocks ~1400 and is very impressive.
Again, you've got to make you're own choices. Now don't call me Anti-45
I'm just responding to your questionNo, not at all... fair enough. I stagger my .45 mags with quality HP and ball because I too consider penetration to be a major issue. Hmm.. well, your information is certainly something to consider. Perhaps I should pick up some -- Nato 9mm.Ronin45230 said:Well, I base my opinion on my experience. I'm one of those guys that feels penetration is second only to reliability (and would only use a handgun if didn't have access to something with more substantial penetrating ability....308, 223, or a 12ga).
Actually, it all depends on the scenarios you are considering; if they involve having to penetrate car bodywork, windows, light structural cover, and/or multiple sophisticated adversaries that know how to use cover wisely (or may even wear protection)...... Follow? Now in an aircraft, or in a thin walled appartment against a punk wearng a T-shirt? that's a different story...
I carry Federal Bonded LE 135+P HP, backed up with Fed NATO 124 FMJ in my G17's. I also have Hirtenberger +P+ for extreme cases.
The 9mm Bonded Law Enforcement HP penetrates better than both the 40 and 45 (Fed LE Bonded HP). The Federal NATO M882 clocks ~ 1265 out of my G17 and defeats protection that'll stop 45 Ball. And the Hirtenberger FMJ? that stuff clocks ~1400 and is very impressive.
Again, you've got to make you're own choices. Now don't call me Anti-45
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MarkW
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Why?CTSA1911 said:
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consider all the options, and decide "what's best for you". you may want to check out my post here......CTSA1911 said:
http://forums.1911forum.com/showthread.php?t=122740
Because ball ammo penetrates barriers better than HP. My first two are HP and then it's staggered from there. I figure if I really need more than the first two it may be because I have to penetrate barriers, etc. Reasonable minds can disagree about whether this is a good idea or not, but I'm still going to do it. Everyone has to decide for themselves about what they need to do to feel comfortable. Besides, .45 ball is plenty effective anyway. Nobody in WWII was complaining about how .45 ball was a poor performer.MarkW said:
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