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Discussion Starter #1
Hey guys. I'm new here. I usually tread in the Chevelle forums, but heard of you there and thought I'd check you out. Very interesting. I'm a former Marine reservist with lots of active duty training and served in the Gulf War in Saudi and Kuwait, so I'm not completely ignorant about weapons and tactics.

Something happened in my home a few days ago that I'd like to get some expert opinions on. I work strange hours in my truck driving job, so I hit the rack pretty early. I was fast asleep at 9:30pm when I awoke to hear my wife screaming, "Get out! Get out!"

I came out of my bedroom and asked her what's up? She said somebody was in the kitchen. All three kids were accounted for. I asked her if she was sure about the presence of an intruder, and she said she just saw movement and heard noises. I wasn't sure if anyone was in the house or not, and I heard nothing and saw no unusual movement from my vantage point. I had not entered the kitchen or the entry way to the kitchen up to this point.

I called out to the kitchen area and demanded that if anyone was there that they should leave with much haste. I also told my wife to call 911 immediately. Keep in mind that I had just come out of a deep sleep and that I still didn't know for certain whether anyone was in the house.

While the wife was calling 911 from our back bedroom, I was grabbing my S&W model 39-2 and racking a Black Talon into the chamber.

I exited the back bedroom and went down the hall to a doorway of another bedroom closer to the kitchen area. I crouched down in the bedroom doorway frame, and announced that the police had been called, that I had a gun, and that I WOULD shoot them if they didn't leave immediately. I was positioned in such a way that I could clearly see the entryway to the kitchen. I still did not see or hear anything. I got up and slowly advanced to the kitchen and peered around the entryway and saw that the kitchen was empty.

During all this, my wife was still on the phone with the cops, and I was telling her to tell them that I was armed and that I had cleared the kitchen. By now the police were at my front door and were also searching my backyard and detatched garage for any perps. I told my wife to ask the cops to advise me on what to do next (for all our safety). The police told me to put my pistol away in the back bedroom and come unlock the front door and let them in. I stashed the Smith and went to the front door, announcing that I was there and was going to unlock it and open it for them. I did so, showing my hands, and two officers entered my home with pistols drawn. They checked out the kitchen, and one officer exited the back door to do some searching, while the other talked to my wife and I. This all happened much faster than it took to type it or read it...at least it seemed to!

As far as I can tell, the perceived movement my wife saw was the kid's artwork on the fridge being blown around by the kitchen ceiling fan...the shadows cast by the billowing paper creating an illusion of human movement!
I suspect that the noise my wife heard was the shifting of dishes in the drain rack! (we are too friggin' poor for a dish washer!)


The wife's feeling pretty stupid, but I told her not to worry about it...better safe than sorry, right?

Anyway, I swear the above story is true. Did I over-react? To all you cops and tactical experts, where did I mess up? What could I have done better? Any and all comments are welcome. Thanks.



[This message has been edited by Walter Zoomie (edited 09-02-2001).]
 

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I'm no tactical expert but dude: buy a dog. I know if theres a strange person in front of my neighbors house down the road, let alone in my damn kitchen.
 

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I would make the house secure enough as to require significant force, and alot of noise for anyone that is not invited to get in at all.

Make sure your wife knows for next time not to start shouting at any suspected intruder. She should know how to use that S&W - and preferably have something of her own, and be competent with it, and other plan(s) of action as well. This a start. Incorporating a "safe room" where you can retreat to, call the police etc is a good idea. Just make sure it has at least one window, in case some nut decides to set your house alight.

I like the dog idea too - providing it is not one of those things that yaps at every little distant noise outside
 

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I agree with making the house hard enough to get into that the BG would have to make a lot of noise to get in, then there is no doubt. Your tactics seemed pretty resoanable to me, not that i am an expert. I think you summed it up pretty well when you said "better safe than sorry" Semper Fi
 

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Sir, if I may comment from the LEO standpoint:

You did very well, indeed. My only addition would be this: If you are going to engage in house clearing, first, make sure your wife is armed, too. It would not do to have you away from your family, with you having the only gun, in that situation.

Actually, a better choice would be NOT to clear the house, but stay under cover with your family.

Don't take this badly though. You did extremely well, kept your head straight, and you and your family are OK. That's what counts.
 

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Discussion Starter #6
Gents:

Thanks for the comments. I thought about a dog, but our house is really small, and the kids play in the yard. I don't wanna mess with dog mess! But it sure would be nice to have a German Shepherd like I did when I was a kid...great watch dogs.

Our house is layed out in such a way that no one could have gotten past me to the wife and kids(unless I was dead!), who were all in one side of the house. There's only one way into the kitchen from the outside, so I had all but one entrance and room cleared. I like the idea of a "safe room." I think I'll do just that.

I also like the idea about another gun and my wife being able to use them. Unfortunately, she's one of those people who are DEATHLY afraid of guns...you know...thinks the gun's gonna leap off the shelf all by itself, load itself, and shoot one of the kids in the brain-pan! I asked her if she remembered how to use the S&W because I've showed her how it functions. She said she couldn't remember!! I also asked her if she wanted to go plinkin' at an indoor range sometime. She didn't seem too receptive. Maybe I should trade HER in!
Nah, I think I'll keep her!

Anyways....thanks for the replies...keep 'em comin'.

[This message has been edited by Walter Zoomie (edited 09-04-2001).]
 

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Walter, there is a post you might want your wife to read

posted on 08 07 2001 by Jim V
in "legal and political news"
titled "Another one for your comments"
 

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My initial impression was that you handled the situation pretty well. I haven't changed that opinion. No matter how much we all want to be Chuck Norris or Clint Eastwood, most of us are pretty much just folks, and functioning well in a potentially deadly situation isn't something we are accustomed to. If you decide to do things differently in the future, think of that as a response to lessons learned, not as a response to your failures when the chips were down.

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If God didn't want us to own guns, why did He make the 1911?
 

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Originally posted by Walter Zoomie:
Gents:

Thanks for the comments. I thought about a dog, but our house is really small, and the kids play in the yard. I don't wanna mess with dog mess! But it sure would be nice to have a German Shepherd like I did when I was a kid...great watch dogs.

Our house is layed out in such a way that no one could have gotten past me to the wife and kids(unless I was dead!), who were all in one side of the house. There's only one way into the kitchen from the outside, so I had all but one entrance and room cleared. I like the idea of a "safe room." I think I'll do just that.

I also like the idea about another gun and my wife being able to use them. Unfortunately, she's one of those people who are DEATHLY afraid of guns...you know...thinks the gun's gonna leap off the shelf all by itself, load itself, and shoot one of the kids in the brain-pan! I asked her if she remembered how to use the S&W because I've showed her how it functions. She said she couldn't remember!! I also asked her if she wanted to go plinkin' at an indoor range sometime. She didn't seem too receptive. Maybe I should trade HER in!
Nah, I think I'll keep her!

Anyways....thanks for the replies...keep 'em comin'.

[This message has been edited by Walter Zoomie (edited 09-04-2001).]
It really doesnt matter if your wife is uncomfortable with guns. Ask her which outcome she prefers. Her family alive and well because she knows how and when to shoot, or her family dead or injured because she doesn't know how and when to shoot.
Let her know there may be times when you won't be around and the defense lies on her shoulders. Then get her trained with at least a basic handling and shooting course.
I know you said you were poor, but maybe the local range or gunshop can work out a barter
deal. Training for your elbow grease or skills in another area?
 

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Perhaps a little easier for the wife to take on board - you can work on the gun angle later: Suggest to her that, had there been an intruder there, making them aware of her presence in the house would not be the best option, while you remained blissfully unaware of the situation and she was unarmed. 'Next time' (hoping, of course, that there never is) it is always more advisable on discovery of an intruder to alert everyone else in the building (ie you) before attempting any form of communication with them. What happens if she challenges them and rather than run from a screaming woman, they attack & incapacitate her instead? They are then free to move through your property, and can tackle you in your own bed with immunity, whether they have firearms or not.

Only challenge when you believe yourself to have a better than reasonable chance of being able to take on the threat when the BG refuses to comply & run off, or when you really have no other option. Similarly, in your shoes i would have got that gun before issuing a further challenge to the kitchen. Ask your wife how she'd react if she was alone in the house in this situation. I personally think it would be better to try and hide, or much more so to escape the house and call for help, if she is not willing to learn to use a gun for home defence.

As for calling in that help, you did the right thing. I really don't think you want to hesitate in dialling 911- If you want to check it out yourself before deciding on the need for backup, you either won't need it, as you found, or it'll be too late anyway.
 

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Wow. The cops came while you were still clearing your house and not sometime after you went back to sleep?

All things considered, it sounds like things turned out well. I am of two minds on whether you shout a warning or do the proverbial shotgun pump sounds to let your intruders know that you are a tough guy armed with mean guns. On one hand, you give the people a chance to leave without encountering them directly and at worst, you suffer some minor losses. On the other, by announcing yourself, you have lost the significant tactical advantage of the intruder(s) not knowing you are there or exactly where there is. Of course the really cool thing is that you didn't shoot the fridge or the kid's artwork!

No slam on the cops. I know they can't be everywhere when we want them to be. I actually have a fear that they will show up too soon and somehow confuse me (being armed) as being the bad guy.
 

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What about installing an alarm system? This would make it easy to know if someone really was in the house and through what place they gained entrance.
 

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Good outcome, but I would offer one piece of advice.

Don't wait for the BG to arrive before you "Rack a Black Talon into the Chamver".

The nextime you may not have the time for that luxury. Rack it now!



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ACK

"Make the First Shot Count"!
 
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