[doberman]

That's it I'm going to do it. There seems to be a few churches in our area that oppose the new CCW law. For some reason they must read a different Bible than I do because they seem to believe that an 11th Comandment states "Thou Shall Not Bear Arms."

I'm going to purchase a quality 1911 and have a custom "IN GOD WE TRUST" engraved on it. I'm slappin that baby on my hip every time I go to church.

 

[HANGFIRE]

If you don't have a sword, sell your robe, and get one.
IGIT

 

[TheHardcase]

That's it I'm going to do it. There seems to be a few churches in our area that oppose the new CCW law.

During the Y2K scare in 1999, our pastor stated in no uncertain terms that anyone who bought a gun, owned a gun, or used a gun for any reason at all was not a Christian. And I attend a hard-core, conservative, evangelical, fundamentalist, in-your-face mega-church.

The People's Republik of Kalifornia -- where secular liberalism and evangelical Christianity meet and morph into a mutated form of both.

I'm going to purchase a quality 1911 and have a custom "IN GOD WE TRUST" engraved on it. I'm slappin that baby on my hip every time I go to church.

That's an EXCELLENT idea. I'd consider doing the same thing, but the ushers with the MP5s and standing orders to open fire on anybody who so much as blinks in the direction of the pulpit during a service would probably not approve of such a practice.

Some people just have no sense of humor.

 

[Mus]

Re: Re: In God We Trust

During the Y2K scare in 1999, our pastor stated in no uncertain terms that anyone who bought a gun, owned a gun, or used a gun for any reason at all was not a Christian.

I would have stood up in the middle of his little diatribe, told him he was a fool and a liar and walked out right then and there.

And I attend a hard-core, conservative, evangelical, fundamentalist, in-your-face mega-church.

No you dont.

There is no biblical support for saying that Christians may not own and use weapons.

In fact, quite the opposite, there is a biblical mandate to own them, and a strong biblical case against pacifism in the face of deadly assault, where it is stated several times that your life is not yours to give.

 

[92FS]

Man, yall should try a presbyterian (sp?) church! Many guys in my congregation carry. And the Pastor preaches from the bible!

 

[Byrd]

My wife and I attend a fundamental church and wile attending the membership class during the question and answer session, I asked the pastor what his as well as the denominations stance were on gun control as well as carrying concealed weapons.

To my delight-neither have a problem with either, and after the meeting I was mobbed by other men who wanted to ask, but didn't have the courage!
I even met two men who are FFL holders who will now get me what I want at dealer cost, as well as making some new shooting friends! One man is even saving his money to buy the parts so I can build him a 1911!

Byrd

 

[gudel]

my FFL here in southern california... is a pastor!

 

[rfurtkamp]

Here the population is 85%+ Mormon.

Never before have I seen a denomination so heavily armed.

I'd fit right in, if it wasn't for my long hair and alcohol and evil ways.

 

[technosavant]

I AM a preacher. I DO preach from the Bible. I will personally guarantee all of you that nowhere in the Bible is weapon ownership prohibited. Although using "sell your cloak and buy one" is pulling it out of context, it does show that Jesus was not philosophically opposed to His followers being armed. That "ruen the other cheek" is in response to insults, not legitimate deadly threats. I even believe that a man with a family must stand ready to defend them, based on "The man who does not provide for his family is worse than an unbeliever," (1 Tim 5:8) and "The husband must love his wife as Christ loved the church and gave Himself up for her." (Eph. 5:25). Taken together, it shows that a man (sorry, ladies- I do admit to a bit of chauvinism on this topic) must be willing to place himself between his family and danger. Add in the lack of any prohibition of weapons, and I would much prefer to be armed when I do so.

If MO ever gets the CCW sorted out and I get one, I probably would carry in church. If a person is known to me (and I think they are a stable sort), I would give permission for them to carry. Everybody just needs to remember that if I am in the pulpit, then even the people in the back row are well within my effective range with my 1911.

 

[SamColtFan]

Techno......
If you don't preach from the King James....you don't preach from the Bible. Eventually, a new politically correct "version" will come along and teach that God is a "her" and "guns are evil". Give it time, it will happen. One nice thing about God's word, it never changes. Stick with the Bible (The King James).

Regards,
Sam

 

[Mus]

Although using "sell your cloak and buy one" is pulling it out of context, it does show that Jesus was not philosophically opposed to His followers being armed.

I would love to talk about that through PMs. I dont see what is out of context about it. Jesus is clearly telling his disciples that he wont be around to provide for them and protect them anymore and that they need to start carrying money and weapons.

 

[shooter58]

Jesus didn't tell them to buy a sword so they could slice their salami....he intended for them to be able to protect themselves.

 

[Mustang]

Uhhhh Mus..... You gotta do a little more research on this subject. Your taking this stuff WAY outta context. Like, really grasping here.

 

[Bearlaker]

At least one of Jesus' disciples was armed and used his weapon in defense of his Lord when the Romans came for Him in the garden of Gethsemane.

 

[Mus]

Uhhhh Mus..... You gotta do a little more research on this subject. Your taking this stuff WAY outta context. Like, really grasping here.

No Im not. Provide backup for that assertion. Provide context that shows I am wrong. Provide some proof beyond your big red way.

In context, we see repeated examples in the Bible of angry crowds of people trying to seize Jesus and them becoming confused or befuddled and Jesus just walking out of crowds.

We also see examples of the Disciples having no supplies and Jesus creating fish and bread and wine from nothng and providing for their needs.

There is plenty of context to show that Jesus is saying he will soon no longer be there for them in that sense and that they need to start carrying money and weapons. Both to provide for their food and shelter and to protect themselves.

I have heard a couple attacks against the instruction to get weapons in Luke and I have answers for both. Bring em on.

At least one of Jesus' disciples was armed and used his weapon in defense of his Lord when the Romans came for Him in the garden of Gethsemane.

Two of the disciples instantly produced swords after Jesus instructed them to obtain them. Which was shortly before he was seized. Obviously they were already carrying them.

 

[Mustang]

OK, being that this isn't the place for this but I'll respond before this is closed this isn't my big red way, it's the Bibles. Also, being that I'm a Baptist but more importantly a saved Christian who loves to seek out other fellow believers and to witness to others who are interested I'd love to carry this on. First off, yes, you're taking it out of context. It is clear that the Bible states that we should live our lives for Jesus and trust Him with our lives. If your trying to imply that we should trust our guns and stash money on the other hand you've missed the point. Our priorites are with Him not our possessions. Jesus may not have been with the disciples physically but he is with all of those who are saved and will provide for us.

Context? Sure, here you go. Matthew 26: 52-53.

52 Then said Jesus unto him, Put up again thy sword into his place: for all they that take the sword shall perish with the sword.
53 Thinkest thou that I cannot now pray to my Father, and he shall presently give me more than twelve legions of angels?

It's clear to me where we are supposed to but are faith with respect to your weapons.

Christianity is not a religion of pacifism. The Bible is clear on that.

I'd encourage you to PM me if you'd like to continue this because I love discussing this stuff and making new friends.

 

[Mus]

First off, yes, you're taking it out of context.

No Im not.

Context? Sure, here you go. Matthew 26: 52-53.
Then said Jesus unto him, Put up again thy sword into his place: for all they that take the sword shall perish with the sword.

Well so me taking a quotation and being able to back it up with other areas of the bible is taking out of context but a two line quotation on your part isnt taking it out of context? Thats very curious.

My version says put up thy sword into ITS place. The fact that the sword has a place is telling in and of itself.

I would be happy to continue it through PMs.

 

[FatFury]

Exodus 22:2 If a thief be found breaking up, and be smitten that he die, [there shall] no blood [be shed] for him.

God said if someone breaks into your house and you kill him,you are not guilty of murder. Thi verse makes clear that you have a God-given right to defend yourself and your family.


Luke 11:21 When a strong man armed keepeth his palace, his goods are in peace:

 

[BarbWire]

Techno......
If you don't preach from the King James....you don't preach from the Bible. Eventually, a new politically correct "version" will come along and teach that God is a "her" and "guns are evil". Give it time, it will happen. One nice thing about God's word, it never changes. Stick with the Bible (The King James).

Regards,
Sam

only problem with that is that isnt the real bible either... the vatican has the one bible and wont show anyone else what it says... the king james version is a translation version of the bible written more to help the kings of england retain control of their subjects than further the word of God. just makes me wonder what the vatican has to fear if people are allowed to see their "secrets". the true word of God should not be kept secret by a handful of men.

 

[Mus]

My PM response to your PM (which incidently was one of the two known challenges I talked about that I had seen before) has two more parts Mustang please clean out your box of older mails.

Thanks.