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Discussion Starter #1
Dear Reloader,

Australian Munitions is making some changes to the way we manufacture our pistol and shotgun powders. These changes are necessary to ensure that we can sustainably manufacture these products for many years to come. We are making changes to both the manufacturing process and formulation of the powders, in order to sustain the manufacturability and throughput of the Australian Shotgun (AS) and Australian Pistol (AP) series powders.

The result of this change will be a new series of powders that will give our customers the performance excellence you have come to expect from ADI powders in both shotgun and pistol applications. This new series of powders will be called the APS series of powders, starting with APS35 that will replace AS30N(Clays), and APS45 that will replace both AS50N(International Clays) and AP50N. You will see these powders start appearing on the shelves after May this year, and we will be making reloading data available for them on our website and in the 2015 edition of our reloading manual, which will be released in May. Our development of APS-series powders to replace AP70N(Universal Clays) is well under way, but we will continue to supply AP70N throughout 2015 until the new powder is ready for release. AP100 manufacture is not affected by these changes, as it is manufactured differently.


http://www.adi-powders.com.au/handloaders/news.asp
 

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Didn't we just go through this with 231?:scratch:
No, this is a different deal and actually confirms from "the horse's mouth" some of the rumors that have been circulating for some time about the Clays powder line. In this case, the manufacturer (ADI) is directly stating what is happening with the powders in question (they are being discontinued and replaced with other powders). With 231, the whole thing is more messy as we just have a distributor (Hodgdon) implying on one hand that the manufacturer (General Dynamics) would like to phase out 231 because it is too time consuming and wasteful to manufacture compared to newer formulation powders and which accounts for the poor availability of the powder from the manufacturer and on the other hand (to me directly in response to my email enquiry) that 231 has not been discontinued nor has Hodgdon been told it is being discontinued and we are left with a question mark with what is going on especially in the future regarding 231.
 

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I just bought 8 lbs of universal. the order went through twice here I thought 16 lbs might be too much. I told them I just needed the 8 lbs . oh well
 

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As far as we know, the new versions may be superior to the existing.
If I had a nickel for every excellent powder we had in the 1960's and then they ran out,
and a dime for the ones that ran out in the 1970's, and then a quarter
for every excellent powder like Alcan that discontinued in the 80's,
I could buy a whole lot of APS35 and run thousands of rounds down range to assess performance.
It may be better than what we've been using.


And maybe they'll put a whole 16 oz pound of it in the one-pound canister rather than 14 oz of Clays.
 

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As far as we know, the new versions may be superior to the existing.
Maybe, maybe not. Winchester discontinued 452AA and then after a few years came out with WST which was "improved" and a hell of a lot more expensive. Is it better? Nope. Is it worse? Nope. Just more expensive. At least it performs pretty much exactly the same and is a dead nutz substitute grain and bulk wise so at least that worked out but I still think the only reason for the change was for Winchester to jack up the price.
 

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all boils down to: have to do SOMETHING to justify my job. same thing happens in the tech world; programmers continue providing UPDATES in order to keep their jobs/income.
 

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Good thing they are still making Clay Dot. Grain for grain replacement for Clays.
where?
i saw a 8lber about 3 years ago!!

i was on the horn with a fella at Alliant a few weeks back
he said they have been shipping powder as fast as they can get it in a can
and its been that way for along time!

im betting that even before the Clay's is gone
Alliant is going to see a huge rush on Clay Dot
 

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the only reason for the change was for Winchester to jack up the price.
Fair enough.

Since they came out with "Ball Powder" when I was in high school, they jacked up the price dozens of times without changing names. Brand new it was $3.95 a pound in tall round paper canisters. Same goes for their rifles, too. And jackets. And ammo. And everything else. Doesn't seem like they need many excuses for price increase.
 

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all boils down to: have to do SOMETHING to justify my job. same thing happens in the tech world; programmers continue providing UPDATES in order to keep their jobs/income.
Nonsense!

It more than likely has to do with production costs, environmental regulations/waste disposal and time. If ADI can make a New powder, faster and cheaper than their Old powders, they would be foolish not to.
 

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Fair enough.

Since they came out with "Ball Powder" when I was in high school, they jacked up the price dozens of times without changing names. Brand new it was $3.95 a pound in tall round paper canisters. Same goes for their rifles, too. And jackets. And ammo. And everything else. Doesn't seem like they need many excuses for price increase.
Yeah, prices have gone up on everything since I was in high school.
 

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I've picked up several old Ideal reloading guides over the years and there are only one or two powders listed that are still available. (namely Unique and Bullseye) Powder companies get bought out, go belly up, or just plain move on so the best thing you can do is to be flexible and have alternate powders.


Grumpy
 

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all boils down to: have to do SOMETHING to justify my job. same thing happens in the tech world; programmers continue providing UPDATES in order to keep their jobs/income.
I keep coming out with updates because the customer changes the specifications (or needs new functionality)
 

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I'd just like to see some clays, the new version of clays or even clay dot in stock somewhere! I've heard it's great for 45 loads, sure wish I could see for myself. Hopefully soon it'll start hitting the shelves.
 

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All the more reason to stick with Alliant.

Many made in the U.S. Most haven't changed in forever, like Bullseye, Unique and 2400.

About the only thing that's changed other than adding a few new foreign made powders is the name. Alliant used to be Hercules.

And, Alliant powders are usually pretty inexpensive.
 
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