Hi folks. I'm new around here and considering a Colt Government model and just want to ask a question. I hear that the series 80 guns are harder to disassemble and maintain. How true is this? I see that the new series 80 guns are about 200 bucks less than the new series 70 guns. Is it worth the extra cash for the series 70? Thanks for any help.
Is series 80 a pain?
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Are we talking about field stripping or detail stripping? I've only owned my current NRM M1991A1 but I'm not aware of an extra step in field stripping a series 80. Am I wrong?
Detail stripping was a challenge but I managed it and I'm no mechanical engineer.
Many and probably most gun owners never detail strip their weapons.
I wouldn't let this issue be a show stopper for you.
Detail stripping was a challenge but I managed it and I'm no mechanical engineer.
Many and probably most gun owners never detail strip their weapons.
I wouldn't let this issue be a show stopper for you.
The first time I did it, I said "This is no problem. If you have three hands." But, believe it or not, it gets easier.
In another thread here at the Colt Forum, I'm defending the Series 80. I have to admit that my feelings have certainly changed about the subject over the past 20 years (or whenever they introduced the FPS). I've mellowed. I've owned a few with the S80 FPS, and all have had a very nice trigger pull created by competent 'smiths for pretty low $$. Oops, that's not your question. Just reminiscing a bit tonight.... Colts can make a guy sentimental.
In another thread here at the Colt Forum, I'm defending the Series 80. I have to admit that my feelings have certainly changed about the subject over the past 20 years (or whenever they introduced the FPS). I've mellowed. I've owned a few with the S80 FPS, and all have had a very nice trigger pull created by competent 'smiths for pretty low $$. Oops, that's not your question. Just reminiscing a bit tonight.... Colts can make a guy sentimental.
Claywms
The Series 80 safety system adds 4 extra parts over the Series 70, and after you have done a detailed diassembly a couple of times you will have it mastered.
For a first 1911 there is no better choice than the basic 1991 Government Model. I agree with the others, save the $200 and use it to buy a good holster and belt, and some ammo. You will much better suited than jumping to the higher priced pistol.
Str8_Shot
The Series 80 safety system adds 4 extra parts over the Series 70, and after you have done a detailed diassembly a couple of times you will have it mastered.
For a first 1911 there is no better choice than the basic 1991 Government Model. I agree with the others, save the $200 and use it to buy a good holster and belt, and some ammo. You will much better suited than jumping to the higher priced pistol.
Str8_Shot
I may be in the minority here, but I like the series 80 trigger pull better than a series 70 and I have both. I like the smooth feel right befort the hammer falls vs the rigid feel of the series 70. You can get a nice trigger pull on the series 80 by installing a reduced power main spring and simply polishing the working parts with metal polish, never removing any metal. I took my Defender down to a very nice four pounds doing this very thing. I did install a Chip McCormick easy fit trigger. It was truly a drop in part. Metal polish is a home gunsmiths friend .
Chuck
.Chuck
Yes!
The Series 80s are a pain to reassemble, but its not completely unbearable......... until you've lost your first firing pin safety plunger spring.
I just choose to eliminate the parts, and avoid the pain, though there is still some minor irritation with the filler plate that must be used in the frame. (I just use the hammer pin to hold it in place while inserting the sear/disconnector and sear pin.)
The Series 80s are a pain to reassemble, but its not completely unbearable......... until you've lost your first firing pin safety plunger spring.
I just choose to eliminate the parts, and avoid the pain, though there is still some minor irritation with the filler plate that must be used in the frame. (I just use the hammer pin to hold it in place while inserting the sear/disconnector and sear pin.)
Series 80 is not a big issue. All modern handguns have some form of passive firing pin block. Does it add parts? Yes, four in the case of the Colt/Para Series 80 guns. Is it a problem to disassemble? No, just a small something to learn. Easy after the third go round. The big advantage is, even in the unlikely event that a sear or hammer fails - the gun cannot discharge unless the trigger is being held back, period. This is a Good Thing.
Tips - To prevent loss of small parts on any mechanism you are new to - put the item in a large, clear plastic bag, or just work carefully as you go and be aware that if the part is backed by a spring, it can head out to parts unknown - but only if you let it.
As for the firing pin lock plunger spring - put a heavy grease in the bottom of the plunger cup with a toothpick - you will never lose the spring again!
Important points - DO NOT imstall or change the setting of the set screw in the so called "Match" Triggers - unless or until you understand how this affects trigger overtravel and sear release/firing pin plunger clearance. Misadjusting this screw can prevent either a Series 70 or a Series 80 from firing!
Minor but important stuff - but the 1911 is not for dolts, in either form. I'm sure you will find it a non-issue in short order - as most of us have.
Warmly, Col. Colt
"Beware of Counterfeits & Patent Infringements" - Samuel Colt, in a mid-1850's Colt Newspaper Ad. More true today than ever!
Tips - To prevent loss of small parts on any mechanism you are new to - put the item in a large, clear plastic bag, or just work carefully as you go and be aware that if the part is backed by a spring, it can head out to parts unknown - but only if you let it.
As for the firing pin lock plunger spring - put a heavy grease in the bottom of the plunger cup with a toothpick - you will never lose the spring again!
Important points - DO NOT imstall or change the setting of the set screw in the so called "Match" Triggers - unless or until you understand how this affects trigger overtravel and sear release/firing pin plunger clearance. Misadjusting this screw can prevent either a Series 70 or a Series 80 from firing!
Minor but important stuff - but the 1911 is not for dolts, in either form. I'm sure you will find it a non-issue in short order - as most of us have.
Warmly, Col. Colt
"Beware of Counterfeits & Patent Infringements" - Samuel Colt, in a mid-1850's Colt Newspaper Ad. More true today than ever!
The extra parts of the FPS in the SLIDE are not a problem,
BUT if you go further and field strip the sear and disconnector and the little extra levers-
YES, IT IS A PAIN!
I have done it only once and never will do it again!
Because the tiny parts for the trigger (lever and spring), which should prevent backmovement of the heavy metal-trigger of 80 Gold Cups
(my gun), I never was able to put these two parts together.
Because this tiny spring is gone into orbit (I never got it back),
I left this 2 parts outside my gun, and I mentioned no difference with or
without them.
OF COURSE- the FPS with the 2 levers in the frame I have (correctly)
reassembled.
BUT if you go further and field strip the sear and disconnector and the little extra levers-
YES, IT IS A PAIN!
I have done it only once and never will do it again!
Because the tiny parts for the trigger (lever and spring), which should prevent backmovement of the heavy metal-trigger of 80 Gold Cups
(my gun), I never was able to put these two parts together.
Because this tiny spring is gone into orbit (I never got it back),
I left this 2 parts outside my gun, and I mentioned no difference with or
without them.
OF COURSE- the FPS with the 2 levers in the frame I have (correctly)
reassembled.
There is no reason to replace the Series 80 firing pin block once it's out of the slide, and the link inside the frame can be replaced with a filler plate for a coupe of bucks. The M1911 went a good 70 years without these attorney added parts and many makers continue to make the original design.
No reason to not replace them either if you want to be able to drop your loaded pistol onto concrete from the third story and have the skills to make it land directly on the muzzle.
-- Chuck
No reason to not replace them either if you want to be able to drop your loaded pistol onto concrete from the third story and have the skills to make it land directly on the muzzle.
-- Chuck
During your first detail breakdown and reassembly of a series 80, you'll probably get a little frustrated. But really, with just a little practice and careful going, it's no big deal to break down and reassemble a Series 80 pistol. Is the Series 70 easier to do? Yes, it is. But the Series 80 is really no big deal if you give it a little careful attention. Do it a bunch of times and it becomes amazingly easy to do. Promise. Don't avoid a Series 80 Colt, they're awesome pistols.
As someone else said, a 1911 is not for a dolt. That's true. But if you're not a dolt, you'll have no problem at all with a 1911.
As someone else said, a 1911 is not for a dolt. That's true. But if you're not a dolt, you'll have no problem at all with a 1911.
Takes a little practice...
But it just takes me just a couple seconds more to detail strip and reassemble a S80
Forget the tooth pick, just put your left index or middle finger in the mag well, from top, so that the tip of the finger can align the lever, sear and disconnector. The second (top) lever is a non brainer... The plunger and spring inside the slide are very easy to work with, you can even use the plunger as a retainer for the firing pin while assembling the FP stop. Just be careful not to lose the little spring, Col. Colt advise is good.
No problem here with the S80 parts!
But it just takes me just a couple seconds more to detail strip and reassemble a S80
Forget the tooth pick, just put your left index or middle finger in the mag well, from top, so that the tip of the finger can align the lever, sear and disconnector. The second (top) lever is a non brainer... The plunger and spring inside the slide are very easy to work with, you can even use the plunger as a retainer for the firing pin while assembling the FP stop. Just be careful not to lose the little spring, Col. Colt advise is good.
No problem here with the S80 parts!
I've heard some sources say that the Series 80s were not good as military weapons because of the extra parts. In what regard do you think they mean this? Is a Series 80 any less reliable under field conditions than a Series 70?
I own a Stainless 1991A1 and I must say that I sort of appreciate the passive firing pin block when my piece is in an inside the waistband holster aiming at the back of my legs!
I own a Stainless 1991A1 and I must say that I sort of appreciate the passive firing pin block when my piece is in an inside the waistband holster aiming at the back of my legs!
The firing pin block will usually at least a pound to the pistol's trigger pull right out of the box. Can be darn near eliminated, but it's still there.
A drop of Militec-1 in the frame recess will hold the parts in place while you install the two little toggles. Be careful on reassembly with the frame inverted ad the toggle will stick out and a forceful assembly will come to an abrupt stop when the toggle meets the rear of the slide.
-- Chuck
A drop of Militec-1 in the frame recess will hold the parts in place while you install the two little toggles. Be careful on reassembly with the frame inverted ad the toggle will stick out and a forceful assembly will come to an abrupt stop when the toggle meets the rear of the slide.
-- Chuck
Chuck, allow me to disagree, if we are talking about taking out the S80 parts and putting a spacer, but not working over the remaining parts, I've never seen a one pound difference in trigger pull due to the S80 parts... IMHO 1/4 pound is more like it. And the difference in "feel" is also very small, I guess most people would not be able to tell apart the guns "with or without" unless there is a problem with the fitting/timing of the parts.
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