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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
After a long wait for parts, I finally get the frame , slide , barrel, mainspring housing, grip safety, slide stop, thumb safety, well , I am sending this
Mess back, ordered a kart mn barrel, $180, and a hard fit, $200, slide will not properly close. Have no idea what barrel was sent, it’s a cheep barrel I can tell .
No name horrible groves and lands, and a chamber indicator none the less. Looks used!
the trigger tracks are completely messed up. Hogged out forward. The ejector was cut for who knows what, I am just stunned …many other issues abound, cannot help but think all this was intentional, I just don’t understand how a company could have screwed up so many things on one gun? Just stunned!
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Unfortunate to say the least, the slide appears to have the ejector cut for a 9mm/38sup ejector, they are different, some like to use them for 45acp as well. The back of the frame to slide is left to be blended, fitting required I guess.

LOG
 

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I hate to see that, especially after waiting to get it. The issues you pointed out should've been caught, they are obvious to the naked eye. Those trigger tracks and ejector cut jump out.

I agree that if I were you I would send it back. Hopefully they will refund you your money. I've heard good things about JEM frames, but I've never had one in hand.

I hope they make this right, it's definitely messed up. I've gotten mystery maker frames and slides and never encountered anything that rough...

ETA, LOG is correct that is a 9mm/38S ejector cut. The ejector blade is thinner in that area for the 9mm/38S ejector.

OP, Was all this supposed to be fit by JEM or just a hard fit between frame and slide?
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 · (Edited)
labor was paid on 3 items.

I had paid for match slide to frame fit, slide rattles. paid for grip safety fit, Grip safety fit, it’s ok? But not great.
And $200 for a hard fit barrel. And $180 for a kart hard fit barrel.
Parts wise. Slide had serrations front and rear, they look nice, tri top, and rmr cuts all look nice.
Paid for a kart nm barrel.
The frame , added a rail, chain link front strap, the chain link on the front strap look odd, it’s a tight pattern in the center, and gets wider at the ends, it just looks off and does not match the perfect chain link on the mainspring housing.
the trigger tracks pretty much made this frame junk imho, I have no idea why this was done, it will never be correct without welding and I don’t know anyone who could weld that deep ,
A huge speed bump in the middle of the trigger tracks, I have seen no jem frame with this issue, pins look good,in as much as I can measure, light rail looks good, one thing about the rail I did not like is that it does not meet the classic cut of the frame, I would machine some of it off to get this to line up, myself, and not look mismatched. Not that big of a deal.
The mainspring housing and its fit are absolutely prefect, and very well done .
also paid for the slide stop and thumb safety, very nice looking parts that match up well.

The barrel bushing was fit horribly, super loose.
The frame rattles, add this to the fubar trigger tracks and a very questionable barrel, this gun will never shoot well at 25-50 yards like I do…
My background is in silhouette. More that combat style.

interesting about the ejector it would have been nice to know they used some other style.
If this is so, I am flat out wrong about the ejector cut, and will admit it.

some things here were very nice indeed.

And some things flat out fubar.

Loose bushing, minor,
sloppy frame slide fit,
And trigger tracks I would say are major.

the barrel was a flat out shady move.

They were paid the asking price, for all this without question, or haggling,
What made things worse was an email about the wrong barrel, and what was said.
I also have a drawer full of crap pull barrels.
And know the difference.
I was sent a crap barrel and know it.
Saying otherwise is not wise.
a barsto, Ed brown, kart, ect are marked.
And have grooves and lands that make barrels like that a worthy upgrade. They are easy to clean, and lead up little.
What was sent is not on that level. The loaded chamber indicator was the cherry on top. Clearly the barrel was a pull from a restricted state. No MN barrel I know has a LCI.


I was to send it back on Saturday but the local small town shipping company no longer works on Saturday, so it will get sent back Monday.

pretty much shot this whole build, and all gathered parts all to pieces.

some parts were very hard to find. Like the rmr 1911 baseplate and the sro.
The wooly mammoth grips in all cream as well…

I am stunned…still over all this.
 

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Yep, that's definitely not a Kart NM barrel. Its a shame because that is a really nice build. You spec'd it out top notch, but the trigger channels is one thing I'm not sure how you could go about fixing.

I suppose Accurails could be used to tighten things up. But not a brand new frame/slide that has yet to even fire a shot. Really a new frame looks to be in order to make the build right. Plus the barrel the Kart barrel you paid for.

Have you dealt with JEM's customer service yet? Curious about what they are going to do to try to square this up. I know how much those parts and labor set you back. It should be right or made right, IMO...
 

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I haven't seen out-of-spec, ill-machined garbage like that since Essex Arms. For the cost and wait times of getting JEM components you shouldn't have to do anything more than minor fitting to finish your build. That there is just one hot mess.
 

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Looks like no Kart barrel that I've ever seen. Sounds like you got a lemon.
I have to note that the area you appear to be pointing out with the arrow below the extractor is a clearance cut that appears on most 1911s. Sometimes you get lucky with a custom build and it is less obvious. There was a long thread on here a year or so back with one guy insisting that his gun was screwed up by the smith because the clearance cut visually contrasted with the slide serrations, creating an optical illusion. I believe that some custom smiths weld to make it more aesthetically pleasing. I don't recall ever seeing that listed as a delete option on a new slide.
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
I did wait patiently for 8 weeks, before I even asked about the order. It’s not like I was pestering jem for this in anyway. I understand parts sourcing takes time, and everyone is busy. I sent one email after 8 weeks. And that is it.

Took about 9 1/2 weeks to get it. And most of that time I was also collecting parts for this build.
Some parts were hard to find. This whole build now out the window.

I just don’t understand this. I know most jem owners do not have issues like this.

i wonder what Elliott was thinking when he sent a barrel like this, after I paid for a kart.
Then tried to tell me that was a “quality part”?

I have a drill Sargent in me wanting to put on the the round brown, drive to Austin , pull out the knife hand, and square this up, or better yet an old school wood line attitude adjustment…it’s a struggle not to do stuff like this…but that is what I feel like.

I have to pray and at this point, keep my mouth closed, and try to patently get this sorted out.
This is something I am not very good at.
And I can admit that.

I also wonder what Ed thinks about all this?
I wrote Ed personally and he is the one who built jem up after leaving ati. I know he put a lot of work in building the company.

I have a few of my own, if someone pulled a stunt like this, in my business, they would be fired. Stuff like this can destroy a business.

I am not trying to do that, I want jem to do what they have done in the past.
I want the company, to succeed, it will have to make some corrections to do so.

my intention is that jem makes corrections.

the ball will be in Jem’s Court , make it right.
Or a full refund.

so do they having a customer who has paid them fully already and waited patiently fix errors ?

or refund money and learn nothing from all this?

we shall see.
 

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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
So it seems that the extractor was cut for a 38? And is correct for that extractor…
And that the cut in the slide is on some slides.
This is my ignorance showing on my first build, and after other issues it drew me into being hyper critical of this gun.

thank you for pointing this out to me.
 

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You should calm down and talk to Jem and not threaten to drive down to Texas with your knife hand out 🤣

Your slide appears to be cut for a 9mm/38 super. .45 commander slides also use that ejector cut. That is a mistake on their part if you spec’d a 45 government slide. You should measure your breech face and see what that dimension is.

The barrel, I have no idea what that is. You can buy Kart barrels with no roll mark and the live round cut may have been added. You’d have to ask them.

As far as your other concerns go, the trigger tracks will be rough, the rounds of the frame will be rough. This is a gunsmith fit frame for gunsmiths. All Jem frames come to you as machined. They market these frames to shops that usually understand that there isn’t going to be any clean up done. This is a feature I find very valuable, even though it takes much more time. I don’t have to worry about lines being ruined during deburring or specs being opened up more than I want them to be.

The relief cut on the back of the slide is a feature on many slides and is not a defect. Some are more pronounced than others.
 

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I haven't seen out-of-spec, ill-machined garbage like that since Essex Arms. For the cost and wait times of getting JEM components you shouldn't have to do anything more than minor fitting to finish your build. That there is just one hot mess.
Jem sells their frames as machined. No clean up. It is a desirable feature to some.

They are good where it matters. They are parallel and the holes are in the right place. This is what matters and where Jem does it better than a lot of companies.
 

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Discussion Starter · #14 · (Edited)
A loose frame to slide fit, is not gunsmith fit, the loose bushing is not gunsmith fit!

I have said nothing about machine marks…
This is about metal missing!

I understand what this is.
Reread what is said! A tri top has no “rounds”
Btw…

the trigger track is not a clean up, it is gouged
The metal is missing, read what I said, no clean up will fix missing metal. For god sake look at the pictures!

I will not tolerate belittling in anyway over this.
Jem was paid. I did my part, I understand what I purchased completely.

the barrel is not a kart, if you were a gunsmith you would know that….
The barrel part of this deal was flat out shady….and Elliot told me it was not a kart himself….so….
Nor does kart even make a stainless barrel.
The barrel sent is stainless!

so……before starting that with me sir.
Best get a few facts together.

I paid , I waited , and jem failed here.
It’s that simple.
 

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We are not enemies. Re-read everything I said but in Morgan Freeman’s voice. 😀 I think if you do that, you’ll see that I’m not being critical of you and you can put your knife hand away.

I’m trying to explain this from the perspective of someone who has built almost 50 guns using these frames.

Yes, they dropped the ball on your slide. It shouldn’t have a 9mm ejector slot.

Your other concerns are very common on these frames. The trigger track has raised sections towards the back. You file these down to fit the trigger you are using.The trigger track is a very hard area to machine and there can be gouges in them. I would rather have a tool mark there than a loose trigger.

Yes, you paid for these services and are not satisfied. Maybe they should suspend these services until they get a better understanding of what is correct. They are a frame manufacturer, not gunsmiths. I think if you pull it back a bit and have a conversation with Ed Minshew instead of having a grievance in a public forum, you’ll see that he’ll bend over backwards for you.

None of us can help you. Only Ed and Elliot can. And you’ll get much further with honey than you will with the knife hand.
 

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Discussion Starter · #16 ·
No the trigger track fits correctly but tight aft…
That part can be worked.

It is hogged out forward. I am not sure why you fail to understand what I am telling you here, regardless of how many frames you have worked , you have not worked this frame.

what you are saying will not work in this case.

if I removed what’s left aft, the trigger bow would fall with no support….again this is about metal not being present , has nothing to do with removing metal, less than 1/2 of the trigger track exists to work work with.

again, I can not work metal that does not exist.
Not sure why you are not grasping this.

Yet again , this is not about me removing metal.
It’s about metal missing.

I am well aware of fitting oversized parts.
That is not the issue here.

the comments about the barrel were uncalled for, and wrong, on many levels.

if you read above, if I am wrong I will admit it.

can you?

I believe you should come down the condescending tone? That helps nothing.



I am just discussing the issue, and have said exactly why I am discussing the issue.

I am starting to think you do not understand the term knife hand and have never served your country?
 

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No the trigger track fits correctly but tight aft…
That part can be worked.

It is hogged out forward. I am not sure why you fail to understand what I am telling you here, regardless of how many frames you have worked , you have not worked this frame.

what you are saying will not work in this case.

if I removed what’s left aft, the trigger bow would fall with no support….again this is about metal not being present , has nothing to do with removing metal, less than 1/2 of the trigger track exists to work work with.

again, I can not work metal that does not exist.
Not sure why you are not grasping this.

Yet again , this is not about me removing metal.
It’s about metal missing.

I am well aware of fitting oversized parts.
That is not the issue here.

the comments about the barrel were uncalled for, and wrong, on many levels.

if you read above, if I am wrong I will admit it.

can you?

I believe you should come down the condescending tone? That helps nothing.



I am just discussing the issue, and have said exactly why I am discussing the issue.

I am starting to think you do not understand the term knife hand and have never served your country?
Sigh.

Just call them and talk. I’m sure that will be helpful.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

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Discussion Starter · #18 ·
It’s been sent back, not much to talk about at this point, the ball is in Jem’s court.
Assuming I have had no communication only shows you have not even read this thread, and have made very false assumptions. Just sayin

blaming me, like you are attempting to.

and keeping it up.

That Helps who exactly? Rhetorical….
 

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You gotta get off the defensive my friend. Any tone you are reading from my posts is all in your head. My barrel comment was this. Kart does sell barrels with no roll marks, the LCI could have been machined by Jem. I don’t know about you but I can not eyeball a SS barrel VS a carbon one. Not even with 11 years in the business and a few 1000 barrel installs. If you can, maybe I need to hire you. If Ed told you flat out it wasn’t a Kart barrel, I didn’t know that.

But, it does seem that you are not getting the concept of the trigger track area. The forward section of the track is relieved quite a bit. The rear section is oversized. This is the only part that really needs to be fit. If your trigger is loose in this area, bend the trigger bow out a little.
 

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...It is hogged out forward. I am not sure why you fail to understand what I am telling you here, regardless of how many frames you have worked , you have not worked this frame...
If I'm seeing what I think I see of the track in your first photo looks completely normal. Please go look at several stripped 1911 frames from various manufacturers. I have NEVER seen a single one by ANY manufacturer where the trigger tracks were not larger at the front than at the back. The forward trigger tracks have to be machined in one step and the rear tracks broached in another. There is NO imperitive for the trigger track to be a single straight dimension from one end to the other. As long as the mortice for the finger piece is in the right place and the right size, and the rear portion of the tracks are correctly dimensioned, then a perfect trigger fit can be achieved. The finger piece supports the trigger at the front, vertically and horizontally. The bow supports it at the rear. Many trigger bows are cut away in the middle either from the manufacturer or by the smith, so any vertical contact with the track from right behing the finger piece to the back 1/4" of the bow is moot. The rear of the bow has more than enough contact to position the trigger.
 
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