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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
OK...I need another 1911. I've got a 5" Colt that runs good, but I want another gun to trade off with. I'm considering either the Kimber Pro CDP or the Les Bear TRS. I like the lighter package the CDP offers for carry purposes, but I've heard quite a number of bad comments about the current crop of Kimbers. I live in Kalifornia and that limits my choices of available guns. The Les bear comes with high praise as a reliable and accurate weapon.

So, from the standpoint of reliability and use as a concealed carry weapon, what opinions do you folks have to offer? I know that the grip is the hard part to conceal well, so barrel length does not effect much with IWB carry. The Bear costs a bit more, but given the serious nature of a carry gun, cost is not a consideration in my decision.

The CDP intrigues me do to added carry options. I like the idea of the concealment vests/jackets that Coronado Leather puts out and don't know just how well they would work with a full sized 1911. I normally carry strong side IWB, but am looking at other options as part of this decision process.


Thanks,

Hank
 

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I used to have a very nice Kimber TLE. The gun was very nice and after replacing the extractor and FP stop it ran without a hitch. I liked that pistol quite a bit but at the end of the day I could not feel comfortable knowing that if I did'nt grab it just right, the Swartz FP safety would stop it from working. I eventually traded it off because of this.
I do have a TRS that I have put about 1000 rounds through and have not had one single problem with. I fully trust it. Not only do I trust it but the fact that it is made without any MIM makes it all the better.
IMHO if it were my choice I would go with the TRS. As far as the weight issue... a good hoslter and belt combination can greatly aid this dilemma.
Bottom line, what is your life worth? A couple of hundred more dollars is chump change when the SHTF, in my opinion.

Good luck in whatever choice you make.
 

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I have a Pro Carry that I only shoot as a 22 (ceiner conversion). Its nice but I do like my Baers much more. I carry my Stinger a good bit if I carry one.

I think the TRS will be on my short list sometime next year.
 

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As noted in the other thread you posted in the Kimber section, it simply isn't apples to apples. An analogy would be.........I have to drive to work each day, do I get a Chevy Malibu or a Lexus LS. Both will get you to work most days. Both will need some attention now and again. The Chevy gets better mileage but you'll smile more driving the Lexus and it will feel better sitting in it. Others will notice the Lexus more than the Chevy.
 

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Kruzr said:
As noted in the other thread you posted in the Kimber section, it simply isn't apples to apples. An analogy would be.........I have to drive to work each day, do I get a Chevy Malibu or a Lexus LS. Both will get you to work most days. Both will need some attention now and again. The Chevy gets better mileage but you'll smile more driving the Lexus and it will feel better sitting in it. Others will notice the Lexus more than the Chevy.
Let's extend the analogy a bit. "I have to drive to work to an area where my car is somewhat likely to be bumped into or door dinged in the parking lot and/or possibly stolen. Which should I drive to work every day, the Chevy or the Lexus?"

As a carry or home defense gun, your pistol will likely be confiscated in the event of a shooting, no matter how justified, and you won't get it back for months, or years or never. Why carry a super premium priced gun if a less expensive gun will serve the exact same purpose? And, most makes of good quality pistols will serve the exact same purpose.
 

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Well if thats the case why the heck own anything nice?? Just use a rock.....:hrm:
 

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TiRider said:
Why carry a super premium priced gun if a less expensive gun will serve the exact same purpose? And, most makes of good quality pistols will serve the exact same purpose.
'Cause it works. I am lucky. I have a GREAT CustomII (which I carry more than my TRS because I compete with it). Multitudes of mail indicate Kimber doesn't build 'em like that anymore. My TRS has been great and fault-free. It is more recently built. I would trust my TRS before any recent Kimber due to the MASSIVE negative traffic regarding Kimbers of late, to include many respected names in shooting and smithing. I love my Kimbers and am unhappy about recent events which they may yet correct but I like my bone bag all in one piece so I want a gun to work EACH and EVERY time. Happily, my Kimber and TRS both do this very well. I vote for the TRS in this issue.

How about this one: "Going into Tal Afar...the M240 or the 1911?...The 1911 is far cheaper......however.....I may need lotsa rounds rilly fast...."
 

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I try to avoid the ___vs___, but have to chime in here. I bought a TRS several years ago. Super accurate, but so tight I had to hire some bodybuilders to break it down. It went away. I'm a Kimber fan, but ONLY the original models. Built just right, not tight. If you can find an original Kimber, grab it!
 

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Deciding which gun to carry based on which gun I'd rather have taken away from me is just plain stupid. I will carry whichever gun I am best able to preserve my life with, as well as those I care about. If I survive and someone takes that gun away from me; more than a fair trade and so be it. I'll just start carrying something equally, if not more effective, and if I have to use it again, you can have it also; after the fact.
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
If Kimber was making them "like they used to" or if I wasn't in Kalifornia and could get a used original CDP, I'd be all over it. This post and the one I put on the Kimber page both seem to echo that the recent batch of Kimbers "ain't all that". The reason the Bear TRS has caught my attention is that my local dealer swears by them and fellow shooters claim to be very satisfied. I know that I'm comparing apples to oranges here, but in a way, that was my point.....Full size, reliable, and more expensive vs. Compact, sometimes questionable, and still not cheap. The CDP seems to be the quintessential carry gun in today's market. Given the choice, I was curious which folks would chose.

As far as losing a gun after a justified shoot.....I won't be happy about it, but if my family is safe it's well worth it to me.
 

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I've shot the CDP and have a TRS with about 1300 rds thru it in 3 weeks and trust my life to it. It's never bobbled and works perfectly with all ammo/reloads and mags (altho I don't use the stockers anymore in favor of 8 rounders). I carry it OWB in a Mitch Rosen Express (until my MS VM2 is done...sometime in '08) and can wear a T shirt over it with no worries (5'9" 190). I'm not a Kimber fan for reasons I won't get into, but you can't go wrong with the TRS. In all fairness, a buddy I shoot IDPA and IPSC with swears by his 3 and they seem to treat him well. As stated above, I generally don't get into pissing matches about __ vs __, but my money would be on Baer.
 

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As a carry or home defense gun, your pistol will likely be confiscated in the event of a shooting, no matter how justified, and you won't get it back for months, or years or never. Why carry a super premium priced gun if a less expensive gun will serve the exact same purpose? And, most makes of good quality pistols will serve the exact same purpose.
Uh, that is a bad philosophy for choosing a carry or defense pistol, especially when you are talking about a Series II Kimber. First, the chances of getting involved in a shooting is fairly low, so why would you compromise. Second, if you did get involved in one, wouldn't you want the best and most reliable 1911 available to save your life?

I have both a Baer TRS, which worked fine out of the box and a TLE RL that needed a lot of work before I could even consider depending on it. I'd rather lose the use of a $1600 1911 than have my family pay a lot more for a funeral. :rolleyes:

To the original poster, if you are looking for something with a lightweight frame versus steel, look at Springfield's or Colt's offerings (assuming they are available in California) and plan on having a good smith work on it.
 

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Discussion Starter · #13 ·
To the original poster, if you are looking for something with a lightweight frame versus steel, look at Springfield's or Colt's offerings (assuming they are available in California) and plan on having a good smith work on it.

I guess I'm trying to buy something that is reliable "out-of-the-box" this time. I don't want to piss anyone off, but most local smiths have not proved to be very good; and the ones that are, only take LEO guns at this point. I've had another pistol at a truly good smith for over a year now. That's my point. I don't want to screw around this time (or at least lessen my chances). My Colt that I shoot now spent four months at a smith to get it 100%.

I'd love to buy a new Colt, but my recent experience with them has not been good. I can't honestly say about Springfield. It just seems to get a gun that runs right from the start, you need to jump to the next level in price and quality.


Hank
 

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I guess I'm trying to buy something that is reliable "out-of-the-box" this time. I don't want to piss anyone off, but most local smiths have not proved to be very good; and the ones that are, only take LEO guns at this point. I've had another pistol at a truly good smith for over a year now. That's my point. I don't want to screw around this time (or at least lessen my chances). My Colt that I shoot now spent four months at a smith to get it 100%.

I'd love to buy a new Colt, but my recent experience with them has not been good. I can't honestly say about Springfield. It just seems to get a gun that runs right from the start, you need to jump to the next level in price and quality.


Hank
Sounds like you want a Baer given your choices. Ed Brown, Wilson, Night Hawk, RRA are all good to but there's still a chance you'll have some reliability issues at first, it happens. I agree with Az Husker 100% on the Series I Kimbers. Too bad about Cali. law but maybe you can find one in state. Good luck.....
 

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At a similar price point (meaning within a couple hundred bucks of each other), the Baer is a no-brainer.

You're getting a hard fit gun with an accuracy guarantee and no MIM parts.

I'll say I've had good luck with my Kimber Tactical II but it's just that, luck. My luck wasn't as good with Springfield, and the new Colts I've bought lately I haven't fired enough to say one way or another (no problems so far though).

Not to mention that the Baer will hold its value a lot better than the Kimber.
 

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I have a Les Baer Concept VII (commander size) and the Kimber Ultra CDP II. I carry both. The Ultra is easier to carry due to size and weight. (I replace the MSH with a Wilson Blue Steel and took off the ambi safety for a single sided). The Baer is an all steel dead on shooter, very smooth. I guess I'm lucky I can break it down easy. There is a huge difference in fit and feel in the pistols with it going to Baer, but I enjoy the ultra as well. All personal preference.
 

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ARE YOU SERIOUS?! YOU'RE ACTUALLY CONSIDERING PICKING A KIMBER OVER A LES BAER TRS?! WHAT ARE YOU SMOKING?!

***....Deep breaths....***

Please, do yourself a favor, get the TRS. There is no 1911 on the market that will outshoot it. NONE. It is 110% reliable, and it's the best shooter I've ever had the pleasure of laying my hands on or carrying. Remember how after you bought your first 1911 you never looked at another gun the same way? That's how it will be when you shoot a Baer. You'll never look at even Kimber "Custom Shop" ( :biglaugh: :biglaugh: :biglaugh: Custom Shop :biglaugh: :biglaugh: :biglaugh: ) guns the same way ever again.

Now, don't get me wrong. Kimber makes the great guns. I love them, and they're some of my favorite pistols, ever. But compared to Baer guns, especially the TRS, SRP or Prowler III 1911s, Kimber is the Michael Jordan of baseball. Just doesn't measure up.
 

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Discussion Starter · #18 ·
OK.....OK....OK......

When "Kimber4Ever" tells me to "BUY THE BEAR.....!!!"

I think I'm already at that point. I know that a full size 1911 isn't the easiest to conceal, but I've come to the realization that whatever I carry will best be handled in a IWB holster. That said, barrel length becomes less of an issue. The grips are all the same until you drop to the shortened frames, which I really don't want to do for a variety of reasons.

The local shop has a TRS in stock. I think I'll venture over there tomorrow and see if we can make a deal. I posted this in a couple of places, and the overall slant of the responses has been towards the Bear. For something lighter and smaller, I think I'll just keep an eye out for a 5-shot wheel gun (been looking for a S&W 696 for a while now).

I really do appreciate the input on this. I know it was a bit of an odd question, but I really wanted to see if folks thought the Kimber would stack up anywhere close to a Bear at a given price to reliability standpoint.


Hank
 

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Discussion Starter · #20 ·
The wait begins.......ten days anyway. I still can't figure out why kalifornia has a "cooling down period" for folks that already own weapons. Oh, well.

Anyhow, I got a good deal on the TRS and a case of ammunition. I feel good about it. The pistol looks great and nicely fit. I hope it shoots as good as it looks. The fellow at the gun shop says that he sells a bunch of them and has only had one that needed to go back to Bear for something minor. I'll pick mine up in a couple weeks, run some rounds through it and let you folks know how it does.


Hank
 
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