[slammedsi]

Wanted to ask what everyone thought about the likely hood of using Liberty Defense 10mm ammo for Texas deer? Shots will be lead then 50 yards. There showing 2400 advertised velocity on the box. Out of my Iver Johnson Eagle XL Long Slide I’m getting 2,472 avg velocity's. It shoots sub 2 inch groups at 30 yards and is very light on recoil. I have herd rumors about people using them successfully on deer and hogs but with the bullet being a fragmenting design and only weighing 60grains I wasn’t sure how it would perform. I use there 9mm version in my duty gun which is mandated by our department. Unfortunately I’ve seen it’s effects first hand. It’s um.. effective to say the least.

 

[Razorback22]

Well, the .22 TCM (and 5.56x24) generally shoots 40 grain bullets and within 50 yards - from a handgun will easily take out deer or hog. Deer fall best to the factory bullet, but I prefer the Speer 40gr Spire point for hogs because it has a much thicker jacket and will easily shatter ribs and skulls. One reason the TCM and by extension the 5.56x24 are so effective is the little bullets hold together very well and tend to deform into ball-shapes which share the energy wealth but keep the core intact for surprising penetration. The Speer 46gr JFP is also great for hogs for shooting from the front - up close. They tend to "turn in" when striking skull bone at an angle due to the flat nose and large meplat.
I saw a pig shot from too much angle where the bullet struck the haunch. Rather than run away, the porker's "hind end" dropped and flopped as he tried to scramble away with three working legs before a second shot entered behind the ear and he went silent. Later we found the Speer 40gr Spire point with it's thick jacket and small exposed tip had completely pulverized the "ball" of the hip joint and carried fragments further into the abdominal cavity. Though not a kill shot, it planted the animal on the spot for a quick finishing shot.

So I would expect the 10mm using Civil Defense to get the job done as well as long as it doesn't have to go through much bone to get into the juicy parts. The bullet is designed to fracture leaving the base to travel forward but just as with shotgun pellets, as chunks of bullet leave the initial mass, energy is instantly lost limiting penetration and the power to break bone. Taken close in on a side or rear quartering shot the CD bullet will easily defeat the rib cage and do a lot of damage just inside the chest cavity with enough to penetrate the heart if the shot hits right. I don't think it would be my first choice for hogs due to the fragmenting bullet - too much potential for fragmenting on the skull without making it through.

Another thought for the 10mm is to use the Lehigh Defense Xtreme Defender load from Underwood or make your own. For deer chose the lightest bullet option - 100gr. and you'll be impressed with the results to say the least. At "pistol distances" the solid copper slug easily shatters bone and creates an impressive wound channel. With the Xtreme Defender you choose a penetration depth then load to the velocity that gets you there with no worries about the effects of bullet expansion negatively affecting penetration. When they first introduced this bullet design they started out much heavier with smaller flutes and a larger tip cruciform. Then they discovered the things would penetrate "forever" and introduced much lighter (for caliber) versions with larger flutes and thin "blades" on the nose cruciform. This reduced penetration in favor of greater energy transfer.

 

[Wilsonedbrown]

I wouldnt use it for deer hunting personally way to light and may not get enough penetration. I use Underwood extreme hunter 150 grain with excellent accuracy and results in the field. As said above by razorback the extreme defenders is an excellent round for hunting it passes through bone with easy and leave an excellent wound channel. The extreme hunter and extreme defender are very similar bullets made by Lehigh. I shot a doe this year at 65 yards with a TRP rmr 10mm she fell in her tracks was a complete pass through of the front shoulders with about 1" wound track and exit wound. Thats about as good as I can ask for a 1911 IMO..

 

[Totally Tactical]

I agree. Your looking for a heavier bullet with penetration.
The liberty stuff is made to fragmentate and not pentrate too deep.
This is very important with Hogs.

 

[Striker2237]

Yeah I wouldn't, I use HSTs or card cast .45 super when going against hogs.

 

[KCJeep]

I am very surprised to hear any agency is using Liberty defense for duty ammo, although I can see it being effective in the right situation for sure.

My buddy has shot two deer in two years with a Kimber 10mm, and he uses Underwood loaded Gold Dots in the 180 grain with excellent results. Deer hunting has different goals and objectives for your ammo I don't think the Liberty stuff is the direction to go in that regard.

Traditional "expansion with good penetration" hunting bullets are what hunters have used for many decades for good reason.

JMO.