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Discussion Starter #1
Are any of you familier with the Colt 38 Supers that were done by the custom shop but with the early slide markings? They were marked Super Match Colt 38 Super on one side and had the patent dates on the other. The serial numbers started with ELCEN****.

Here is a picture of an example.

Anyone know where I can find one available?

Thanks

 

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I have seen some of the "ELCEN" serial numbered guns but have never seen one with the rollmarks like the old guns. Were the guns you are asking about blue or bright polished stainless?

Bob
 

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Mears...is the picture of the gun above the one with the ELCEN serial number or is it just an example of the slide of an original gun?

Bob
 

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Discussion Starter #5
That is the actual picture of the gun which has the ELCEN serial number on the frame. I am thinking that maybe someone just put a different slide on this frame.
 

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or...

...Colt is just screwing with us again dropping a few left over parts together and creating an instant collector. I have run into Supers that I didn't even know existed, were never advertized...nothing.

The finish on that gun is very interesting...like a bed blasted blue or parkerized?



Bob
 

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I had no idea Colt had made anything like that; very cool. With a hi-polish blue finish, that gun would be spectacular.
 

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DWDude said:
hmmm valid question or shameless plug?? :confused:

http://www.gunsamerica.com/guns/976617648.htm
I sent the seller some questions which should make it easy to detemine if this is a recent gun or not...does the slide have the provisions for the Series 80 firing pin block or not? If it doesn't then the gun is definately a parts gun that has been refinished in an e-nickel or satin hard chrome.

Also is it stainless or carbon steel.


Bob
 

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Looks original.....

The seller responded....



Bob
Yes, it is a series '80 that has the firing pin block
It is all stainless steel
It has a matt finish, not satin nickle.
Brian
714 893 1300


...so it looks like it is another uncataloged Colt Super.....nothing new as they seem to be releasing these "parts" guns all the time. It is too bad the original buyer didn't realize the value of this gun and kept the box and paperwork with it. So it is worth whateve anyone is willing to pay for it. Pretty gun...

Bob
 

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That gun is a fraud.

It is seemingly a stainless elcen that was in really bad shape and "restored"(hence the finish over the beat up areas on the slide and around the hammer pin area on the right side). I am guessing the slide was remarked. If you look carefully, the markings appear to be reworked and not original rollmarks.

The "restorer" used a heavy bead blast to cover up the rest.

Some of this sellers guns are too good to be true.
 

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Anthony Lombardo said:
That gun is a fraud.

It is seemingly a stainless elcen that was in really bad shape and "restored"(hence the finish over the beat up areas on the slide and around the hammer pin area on the right side). I am guessing the slide was remarked. If you look carefully, the markings appear to be reworked and not original rollmarks.

The "restorer" used a heavy bead blast to cover up the rest.

Some of this sellers guns are too good to be true.
I would have to disagree....I don't think that the gun was "restored". The damaged area appears to be on the surface of the stainless. If the gun was to be "restored" why not just polish out that area and recut the area of the cocking serations "before" bead blasting? Second, how could the slide be "remarked". Those are original Colt rollmarks. It could not be done by hand and someone would have to have an original Colt stamp and the rollstamping machinery to do that...for one $1100 fake?

I have seen several ELCEN prefix serial numbered guns that were out of the Colt Custom Shop. I believe that the original "El Cenator" was one of the original "El" series guns made for Lew Horton Distributing Company. Why there are so many frames running around with the ELCEN prefix is one of those Colt misteries. But I have seen several variations of Custom Shop guns some of them being high polish some matt but none that I can remember with the old 1940s vinatge Super Match rollmarks.

I wonder if Colt would tell one over the phone if this variation was made....maybe I'll give them a call leter.

Bob
 

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Anthony Lombardo said:
Some of this sellers guns are too good to be true.
...you may be correct. I looked at one of the other "Super Match" guns that this person is selling. Funny but the rollmark on that gun is EXACTLY of the same style as on the ELCEN gun...in addition if one looks at Douglas Sheldon's book on the .38 Super, almost all the right side rollmarks are higher on the slide than the one on the ELCEN and the $5K gun he has. Also there is only one stamp that I can find that all the letters are square to the end next to the Pony...and it happens to be on these two guns....

As is always the case...Buyer Beware.

Bob
 

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The damage to this gun is under the matte blast finish. That is signal#1 that the gun has been refinished. Grip screws do not match and neither do the era of the grips.

The rollmark is incorrect. The closer you look the more you will see.
 

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My screne doen't show the damage well enought to say one way or the other so you may be right about the damage being under the a new beadblast finish.

As to the grips...I have a pair like that and they came on a 1986 Super Elite. With Colt one never knows what will be in a parts bin.

As to the rollmarks, please be more detailed in your explaination... They look like the same ones on a 1940s vintage SuperMatch that is in the book. I agree they are "period" as in what one would find on a 2004 model but I have seen a lot of "one of a kind" roll marks come out of Colt in the last 10 years.

Bob
 

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Called the Custom Shop but the guy who has the answers is out of town till next Tuesday and I will be out of town for the two weeks starting Monday. 1-800-962-COLT if anyone wants to ask about the origin of the gun.... Guys name is Joe.

Bob
 
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