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Discussion Starter #1
I saw the movie "No Country For Old Men" with Tommy Lee Jones and Josh Brolin yesterday. It was one of the best movies I've seen all year. Tommy Lee (the Sheriff) was making an armed entry with his 70 Series Colt .45 (it had the Colt medallians on the grips) and he just cocked the hammer prior to entry, indicating that he was carrying one in the chamber with the hammer down. This is NOT the way to carry a 1911 .45 because an accidental drop could cause the gun to fire. My question is: What is the difference between the 70 Series Colt (no firing pin block) and the 80 Series Colt (with the firing pin block) in this regard. Are they both equally unsafe to carry with one in the chamber and hammer down?
 

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I thought he carrying half cock ala Mike Hammer. His holster did have the leather strap/hammer block though out the movie.
 

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Discussion Starter #3
45works said:
I thought he carrying half cock ala Mike Hammer. His holster did have the leather strap/hammer block though out the movie.
Good point. I did see the leather strap. Are you saying that would make it a safe mode of carry?
 

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yer killin' me

Perhaps this movie is make-believe?



---------------------------------

"all my disbelief is suspended disbelief"
 

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Just think about it for a minute, notwithstanding that any gun-handling you see in a movie is usually just for effect (in this case producing the satisfying sound of the hammer being cocked) and has nothing to do with good practice. If you did carry loaded with hammer down, the FP is still not in contact with the primer. The FP spring is slightly compressed, making it a little stiffer. The fact that the hammer is in contact with the FP could have no effect on the FP in a drop condition - the hammer is resting on the FP stop. The FP will be accelerated forward in a muzzle drop just as it would if the hammer were back except it won't have quite as far to go to hit the primer. Particularly with a strong FP spring, this would seem to be a legitimate carry mode. I know that the 1911 has been carried like this over the years. Has there been a known incident of drop-firing from this mode?
 

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Safe? No, but accurate for the time period. I remember Bianchi holsters featuring the safety strap from the early to mid eighties.
 

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Texagun said:
...My question is: What is the difference between the 70 Series Colt (no firing pin block) and the 80 Series Colt (with the firing pin block) in this regard. Are they both equally unsafe to carry with one in the chamber and hammer down?[/B]


Both can be carried chamber loaded and hammer down.

Series 70 (no firing pin block) It is possible for this type pistol to fire (hammer cocked or uncocked) without pulling the trigger. But, it's extremely unlikely this will happen. The gun has to be dropped/impacted just right to cause the firing pin to move and strike the primer. This is a hotly debated issue with valid points on both sides. The actual/verifiable cases of this happening are few and far between.

Series 80 (firing pin block) Ain't no way the pistol can fire, except by
pulling the trigger. Safety must be off, hammer cocked and the trigger pulled for the gun to fire. Assuming, we are using a correctly functioning pistol.

Which one is more safe? I'm not going there, I've been flamed too many
times for my old fashioned views.

You decide.
 

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Texagun said:
My question is: What is the difference between the 70 Series Colt (no firing pin block) and the 80 Series Colt (with the firing pin block) in this regard. Are they both equally unsafe to carry with one in the chamber and hammer down?
They are both to safe to carry with 1 in the chamber, hammer down. Getting them to that condition is the dangerous part.
 

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Texagun said:
I saw the movie "No Country For Old Men" with Tommy Lee Jones and Josh Brolin yesterday. It was one of the best movies I've seen all year. Tommy Lee (the Sheriff) was making an armed entry with his 70 Series Colt .45 (it had the Colt medallians on the grips) and he just cocked the hammer prior to entry, indicating that he was carrying one in the chamber with the hammer down. This is NOT the way to carry a 1911 .45 because an accidental drop could cause the gun to fire. My question is: What is the difference between the 70 Series Colt (no firing pin block) and the 80 Series Colt (with the firing pin block) in this regard. Are they both equally unsafe to carry with one in the chamber and hammer down?
Please don't confuse hollywood garbage with reality.
 

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He probably cocked the hammer for Hollywood cool gun effect. Hollywood producers can't go for more than a day or two without their satisfactory hammer cocking sound effect, even if they're filming with Glock props. Not to mention shotguns which are never stored or carried with one in the chamber, and if there were one in the previous scene then the actors will need to rack it again for every change of camera angle.
 

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True,joffe. Unreal gun handling in a movie?! :eek: Say it ain't so...I've seen the slide on Glocks and Berettas get racked as much as five or six times before they're fired!

And I have to add that most any 1911 can be carried with the hammer down,but it's pretty dangerous to drop that hammer on a loaded chamber. I'd say it's more dangerous to try and lower the hammer than it is to carry with the hammer back and the safety on! "But my uncle did it all the time and he was a cop/SEAL/Marine/Agent of the Crown/Men in Black!" Good for him. It's still a bad idea.
 

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What Mr. McVay said!

I remember some Grade C movie where two cops exit their vehicle after a traffic stop and rack their slides to load a round.
 

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All modern movies have the good guys and bad guys alike manipulating their guns for effect just as the action is "expected" to start.

Hammer cocking, slide-racking, revolver cylinder-flicking; I'm still annoyed by it even after decades of living with TV and Hollywood portrayals.
At least the older Westerns didn't have much of it!

A TV/movie "hero" who always had his weapon in a state of readiness; imagine that! How boring....
 

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Discussion Starter #15
LW McVay said:
Please don't confuse hollywood garbage with reality.
Thanks for that. I realize it was a movie. I realize it is fantasy. I realize it is not reality. I mentioned the movie as a lead-in to my question, namely:


What is the difference between the 70 Series Colt (no firing pin block) and the 80 Series Colt (with the firing pin block) in this regard. Are they both equally unsafe to carry with one in the chamber and hammer down?
 

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As already mentioned the actual CARRYING IS SAFE. it's the LOWERING OF THE HAMMER ON A LIVE ROUND WHICH IS DANGEROUS. One slip of the thumb and there is a hole where there previously was not.

Plus there is NO GOOD REASON to carry this way. NONE. Condition 1 is safer and faster.
 

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The thread has been answered and closed. No sense in promoting foolishness and unsafe gun handling.
 
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