[Walking Point]

I've never had this problem before, so could you guys check out the photo and tell me if this is a good reason for the gun to NOT go bang. Needless to say I'm taking about the Charles Daly sample, as my cheapo brazilian slide has been a winner.

 

[James]

That one on the left sure looks suspect. I would say that it is very possible that is a reason for it not to go bang. Probably hitting so far towards the edge that the anvil isn't doing what it's supposed to.

WP, does the barrel seat too high or too low in the slide (or heaven forbid - is it sideways?)?

 

[Newton]

Question is which is off center. The frame rails, or the slide? I tried to cut and paste a little Word Drawing, but it didn't work. The frame is the easy one to eliminate just by measuring the material thickness where the rail slot has been cut. Measure the width of each side to where the hammer sits when down, and subtract the left from the right, or vice versa. If the problem is the frame, you should be seeing a difference greater than .030" judging from the pic you posted. You can do the same with the slide.

hmmm....just thought about it, and if the frame rails were cut that much off center, I'm really surprised that the hammer doesn't interfere with the hammer notch in the slide. Could be the slide, or the firing pin itself may be off center. Anyways, all those posibilities can be verified with simple measurement using a vernier caliper.

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Really interesting....Don't ya think??

[This message has been edited by Newton (edited 05-22-2001).]

 

[Walking Point]

The case from the Brazilian slide was fired using the same frame, so I don't see the frame being at fault here.

I never fired the gun with it's original link because it was so crappy (see photo below) and the lockup was so bad.

I did install the crappy link and "fired" some of these cases with the off-center indents. That resulted in the strike being more centered; not perfect, but better. Tomorrow or so I'll take it out and fire real ammo through it. I may fit an extra barrel tonight just to see how the centered the firing pin is with it.

I'll measure the slide tonight and see if it's out of whack.

I can just put the Brazilian slide on this frame since it doesn't have a "home" at this time, but I'd rather not admit defeat this quickly.

I probably need to get a link assortment, which may result in getting the firing pin centered, since I think I think it's a high/low issue.

I had originally thought this was a hammer problem, but a new hammer and mainspring had no effect. Once I looked at an empty case the reason became much clearer.

 

[Newton]

Boy...I gotta say that at this point, interpretation is everything!!! Looking at your initial photo, I didn't even stop to think that it isn't a left/right thing, but maybe an up/down thing. The link will absolutely have an effect on the barrel lockup height with respect to the firing pin. Sounds like you're on the right track.

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Really interesting....Don't ya think??

 

[gyp_c]

Have been going through very similar probs with an SA...It never fail to fire, but it's certainly off-center. The smith that worked on it says it's the barrel fitting was poorly done and it's as close as it's gonna' get. The one in mine's lugs aren't even fully engaged. You may be able to correct yours...good luck...BTW the thread is in Gunsmith forum under barrel lock-up or somethin' from a week or so ago...

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>>>>>>>>>>g2<<<<<<<<<<

I Like The Shade Too!

 

[JSP]

WP

Ditto JamesP - that strike is pretty far out to the edge

If you're going to fit a barrel, you'll find out anyway but...put an index mark on the top of the cartridge rim with a sharpie when it's in the mag before firing - then you'll be able to reference whether the strike is hi or low.

If the CD link is longer (as it appears in the pic), it sounds like the GI link you tried was short and keeping the barrel low - giving you a high strike.

Following your CD saga with interest

JSP

 

[Walking Point]

The original link was hand filed (check out the elongated hole) for some reason.

Perhaps this allows the barrel to lockup higher, giving a more centered strike (still not centered).

I have yet to shoot the gun with this original link, but that's my next plan.

After that I think the best bet is to just fit my spare cheap barrel (damned if this is getting one of my Ed Brown barrels) and experiment with links until the strike is centered.

I've been too disgusted to shoot the gun this week, but may take it out today just to see what it will do in it's original crappy configuration.

UPDATE

The gun will be going back to Charles Daly for repair or replacement (my fingers are crossed hoping for replacement) ASAP, so I will not be shooting it today, and will hopefully never be shooting it with this off-center condition again.

[This message has been edited by Walking Point (edited 05-23-2001).]

 

[CMC]

Check the link below on barrel fit at Brownell's



Brownells
1911 AUTO BARREL ALIGNMENT GAUGE


Fast Check For Proper Lug Engagement & Firing Pin Alignment
Valuable barrel fitting aid for the gunsmith and a great "used gun" checker for the dealer. Slip into barrel of any 1911 Auto, even pistols equipped with compensators, and the centered tip will drop into the firing pin hole on a properly-fitted factory barrel. A little layout fluid on the breech face shows exact align-ment, helps accurately fit expensive custom barrels to degree of lockup wanted.
SPECS: Centerless ground "
Also you can paint line on a primed only case at 12:00 and dry fire it, you can neutralize the primer first if you prefer.
http://www.brownells.com/benchtalk/03summer1998/02Barrel%20Fitting%20The%201911%20Auto.asp

 

[Sparks]

The off-center primer strike is due to improper barrel fit (vertical lockup). Whether a barrel can be fit correctly in your slide depends upon the slide tolerances of the lug recesses, and the location of the FP hole. A quick check can be made by chambering a round with the FP removed. You can mark the FP position on the primer with a small wood stick and some ink.
-Sparks

 

[VC]

This is taken from the July 2001 issue of G&A Handguns. " Case Inspection Can Tell A Lot about How Your 1911 Pistol Is Functioning" Off-Center Firing Pin Strike.
"Surprisingly, some pistols may come from the factory exhibiting this condition. Most often, however, it's a result og "accurizing" a 1911-style pistol, where the barrel is forced up more tightly into the locking grooves in the slide. A long barrel link is the usual culprit here. While there is no danger, and the pistol may fire reliably, target-grade pistols may not show uniform velocity fromany given load. This is because the firing pin does not impact in the area optimum for good ignition. In a combat pistol where gilt-edge accuracy is not an issue, it's not a real problem. However, for target pistols, the solution is to drill out the firing pin hole set a bit lower in the slide. This will give the desired central firing pin strike and help assure uniform ignition."
Hope this article will help you out.
VC

 

[VC]

Sorry about the this line. "for target pistols, the solution is to drill out the firing pin hole and insert a bushing with a new hole set abit lower in the slide.

 

[Walking Point]

I no longer have to worry about the off-center condition, at least on THIS pistol.

My "rather defective" FS model is being replaced with an Enhanced model by KBI.

 

[Sparks]

I disagree that welding up the firing pin hole and inserting a bushing is the right approach, *unless* the firing pin hole was drilled incorrectly by the manufacturer. Obviously, the FP hole should be centered on the the FP chamber. Sloppy vertical lockup is the real problem in most cases. Long link is also heading down the wrong path. During lockup, the barrel lugs stand on the slide lock pin, not the the link. If your barrel has too much lockup, the FP strikes low. Then, you start with a new o.s. barrel, or try welding up your slide if you are a good welder. If the strike is high, increasing the lockup will center it, but now your bottom lugs will be short and need some welding...(applies if the lugs have already been cut).
-Sparks