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I'm new to this forum. I've been shooting along time and am getting back into pistols. I shoot left hand. My p-13 eject some of the brass back in my face. Is this common or can it be fixed? I'm shooting a 185swc, I have installed a wilson guide rod and buffers. I,m using the light spring that came with the kit, the heavy 20lb I could hardly rack the slide. Any advise there?

Thanks
Mike
 

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I assume the gun is broken-in. If so, try different loads, to see how ejection pattern changes. If you're gonna stick with this particular round, take the gun to a 'smith and have the ejector re-tuned to change the ejection throw. No biggie.

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Make It Hot!
 

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Para-Ordnance Ejection into the Face Syndrome

I'm reviving this old topic from 2001 instead of starting a new topic to avoid the "please use the search function" comments. :)

Anyway . . .

I'm currently tinkering with a mid 1990s vintage Para-Ordnance P13.45 lightweight. It runs like a champ with anything I've fed through it, including 230gr FMJ of various brands, 230gr Gold Dots, and some old handloads with 200gr LSWC over 5.8gr of WW231.

So . . . what's the problem?

The problem is the classic P-O tendency to lob the spent brass into my face, usually the forehead. I'm probably not the one who has seen this from many Paras over the last ten years, but I have zero experience with their newer guns, and therefore I have no idea if they still tend to do it.

My first Para (a lightweight P14.45) did the same thing when it was new, but when I installed an 18# recoil spring, it quit doing it and has behaved nicely for over 12 years now.

Other have been fixed by tuning the ejector by changing the angle on the front end.

Unfortunately this particular gun has resisted the ejector tuning. There has been some success (only about 1/2 to 2/3 of a given mag hit me now).

I suppose that my next best bet is to focus on the extractor. This makes me nervous because of the "if it's not broken, don't fix it" concept. This gun runs perfectly other than its ejection pattern (even with all of the Series 80 parts installed!), so it makes me nervous to start bending/unbending the extractor. I've dealt with too many 1911-pattern guns that couldn't be as reliable as this little jewel in their best dreams. As it is, the ejection is more of an annoyance than any kind of real problem as long as everything else works.

Should I work on the extractor next? It passes the tension test where it's supposed to hold a loose round, etc. Do I want more or less tension to make ejection change directions to the right instead of rearward?

If I do go to work on the extractor, I will probably buy a new Series 80 extractor and save the original for "just in case." That way, the worst case scenario would put me back where I am now with the original extractor, but if it works, then I can just put the original in my parts box in case the new extractor goes belly up in the future.
 

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I have similar pistol. Grip is what causes mine to throw brass straight back. If I loosen up just a little they come back into my glasses. Not that uncommon with alloy framed 1911's, they dont have the weight to keep them in place like a stell frame gun does.

As for the extractor, this para is different than other 1911's I've had. There is almost no bend in the extractor when tensioned correctly. If I add a slight bend to the extractor I get FTF's, too much and it wont even pull the first round out of the mag! I agree with buying a new extractor so that you can just put this one back if you really mess up with the new one.
 

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My Para Companion developed extraction problems for some obscure reason.

I purchased a Weigand extractor tension gage (used with a trigger pull gage) and discovered I had 3oz of tension. Recommended tension is somewhere arouond a pound and a half. Did some adjustments to get it in the recommended range.

We'll see how she does this weekend! I'm hoping this gage takes some of the alchemy out of adjusting this.

Nothing more than this. Two thingies in the set: .45/10 and .38/9



-- Chuck
 

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rhino465,
Before you start tuning the extractor check to see if the extractor is clocking.
When an extractor clocks it can change the ejection pattern of the brass.

To everyone that's considering tuning the extractor in their gun there's much more to it than just bending the extractor for the proper tension.
When tuning an extractor you must consider all the angles on the nose of the extractor for the best reliability from the gun.
There's five angles that one should pay very close attention to on the nose of the extractor; once the angles are cut properly I high polish the nose.

Regards
Bob Hunter
www.huntercustoms.com
 

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Hunter Customs said:
rhino465,
Before you start tuning the extractor check to see if the extractor is clocking.
When an extractor clocks it can change the ejection pattern of the brass.
Bob: Thanks for reponding!

I never thought to check that, but I will. If it is rotated (or rotating), do I fix it with a new (bigger) firing pin stop? Or will I need a new extractor fitted?


Hunter Customs said:
To everyone that's considering tuning the extractor in their gun there's much more to it than just bending the extractor for the proper tension.
When tuning an extractor you must consider all the angles on the nose of the extractor for the best reliability from the gun.
There's five angles that one should pay very close attention to on the nose of the extractor; once the angles are cut properly I high polish the nose.
I've only fit one from scratch to a gun, and it was an STI extractor to a 9mm Springfield. I probably got lucky ... all I did was bend it until it worked well, then a buddy polished the heck out of the nose.

Will some manufacturer's parts require less work in the angles you mention?
 

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The Ed Brown and Wilson extractors seem to have all the proper angles. Tested with Wolf, Winchester, and Federal HydraShoks with no problems an hour or two ago.
-- Chuck
 

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rhino465 said:
Bob: Thanks for reponding!

I never thought to check that, but I will. If it is rotated (or rotating), do I fix it with a new (bigger) firing pin stop? Or will I need a new extractor fitted?




I've only fit one from scratch to a gun, and it was an STI extractor to a 9mm Springfield. I probably got lucky ... all I did was bend it until it worked well, then a buddy polished the heck out of the nose.

Will some manufacturer's parts require less work in the angles you mention?
Fitting a new firing pin plate should solve the problem of the extractor clocking.

I've used a few Wilson extractors in the past, they were furnished by the customers however I'm not fond of them. I've used a lot of Ed Browns in the past they requrie a lot of extra work. Now I'm using some 4330 extractors I'm very fond of, that being said all the extractors needed attention paid to the five angles along with the proper adjustment for extractor tension and a high polish on the nose.
Regards
Bob Hunter
www.huntercustoms.com
 

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rhino465 said:
Okay ... I checked the extractor and it was rotated about two, maybe three degrees from having the flat side vertical.

Is that enough to cause the ejection problems (brass hitting me in the face)?
Could be. Since the gun is ejecting reliably I'd not change the extractor yet. If you are a do it yourself type, you can peen the existing firing pin plate to prevent the clocking movement and if it fixes the problem get a proper replacement fitted latter. If it doesn't solve the issue, since you can't see where you peened the plate (assuming you did it right :) ) when the gun is assembled its no big deal to stay with the original if its not the solution.

--wally.
 
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