Exactly. And now Trump says he's considering a quarantine of NYC and NJ...
Where are all of the "Don't Tread on Me" folks now?????
RI Governor suspend the Constitution - Blockade of NY cars
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Where are all of the "Don't Tread on Me" folks now?????
Clearly.
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I brought this up weeks ago when there was first talk of travel restrictions and lockdowns.... and the response here was "meh..." However, NICS gets shut down, and everyone flips a lid....
Rather Animal Farm-esq... "All rights are created equal- but some are more equal than others".
If you're not willing to make some noise about ordered lockdowns (with criminal sanctions for violation), and closed interstate borders, you've lost all credibility on any Constitutional issue- including the 2A. You've forfeited your opinion....
There are different ways to look at it.
If someone tells you that you can not do something that you have no wish to do. How upset about it are you really going to be?
That’s a tad much......even from you.
Absolutely. You either believe in ALL of the Constitution, or you don't. One doesn't pick and choose those things you believe in and those you don't. We already have plenty of the latter. They're called "politicians".
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Don't know if it is legal for a Governor to do it per se, but the CDC can...They sourced their power to the commerce clause in the Constitution...(I also posted this link in the "Virus" thread.
https://www.cdc.gov/quarantine/aboutlawsregulationsquarantineisolation.html
So if POTUS or any Governor gets the support of the CDC it will be difficult for someone to win a suite...
That leads to the other thread: "The next civil war", and we know how serious to take that one. If anyone thinks someone is going to storm a governor's mansion, the white house or the CDC over this, they better go get their temperature checked ;-).
And before someone gets outraged and accusing me of not supporting the constitution, whether I like this or not, or you like it or not, is not the discussion, it is whether it is legal, and apparently it is...The only way you can prove it is un--Constitutional is to either do it in court, or the "next Civil War" ;-). Good luck with both options. For NYC, maybe due to the scale involved you might have a chance in the suite, on the other had, I wouldn't take the side of the bet that any judge would overturn it in what has now been called a "war".
https://www.cdc.gov/quarantine/aboutlawsregulationsquarantineisolation.html
So if POTUS or any Governor gets the support of the CDC it will be difficult for someone to win a suite...
That leads to the other thread: "The next civil war", and we know how serious to take that one. If anyone thinks someone is going to storm a governor's mansion, the white house or the CDC over this, they better go get their temperature checked ;-).
And before someone gets outraged and accusing me of not supporting the constitution, whether I like this or not, or you like it or not, is not the discussion, it is whether it is legal, and apparently it is...The only way you can prove it is un--Constitutional is to either do it in court, or the "next Civil War" ;-). Good luck with both options. For NYC, maybe due to the scale involved you might have a chance in the suite, on the other had, I wouldn't take the side of the bet that any judge would overturn it in what has now been called a "war".
Constitutionality of an overarching quarantine is highly debatable. The commerce clause cited, CLEARLY applies to INDIVIDUALS. Nowhere is an "en masse" incarceration or quarantine mentioned. Nowhere. That any politician, be they a governor or a pOTUS, believes they can invoke a quarantine "en masse" should immediately be challenged in court.
And I suspect it will be. And Damn Well should be.
What I'm amazed at is the willingness of so many here to rollover and accept it like an electric prod up a minks ass.
EDIT:. In fact, a Federal Quarantine Order has to be filled out for EACH PERSON placed under Federal Quarantine Order per the CDC ,via the Commerce Clause. So the Feds are going to do that for 9 million people??? Yeah..... Right.....
Reread the previous couple of posts...... I suspect you just like to play the internet tough guy, but no one I see here is ‘rolling over’.
If you really believe that, they offer online reading Comp courses.
But by all means, be the tip of the spear. Go hire yourself a firm to take anything to the courts over this. Good luck.
Old Remus usually has some wisdom to dispense with.
Got food? Ammo? Meds? It's too late now to prepare adequately for the pandemic much less the impending derailment of civilization itself. Preppers were calmly topping off their stashes in early January, at regular prices, in any quantity with lots-o'-choices. They saw the foreshadow of this emergency and acted appropriately. Prepping always looks crazy until the rug gets pulled. Paranoia is a survival tool, panic is not.
Systems are visibly collapsing. The stock market is out-crashing the 1929 debacle in both speed and depth. "No Admittance" signs are posted at hospitals and needed surgeries are being cancelled. Police aren't responding to anything less then a murder in progress. Cities are opening the prison doors and chasing off the inmates. Food wholesalers were cleaned out in a fortnight and many can't restock enough to matter. Others have stopped answering their phones.
Guns and ammo are selling at a record rate. Dealers say even anti-gun leftists are buying 'em. No one will say it, but it won't take much scarcity for the perpetual EBT Diversity to go where the food and supplies are. It's just there they'll meet real resistance for the first time in their lives. The suburbs have learned their family freezers are worth more than social posing. Unlike the stock market, price discovery will be utterly reliable when it comes to fried chicken and a six pack.
Our Open Borders Diversities already clog the ER and get it all for free because you're paying their bills. Activists will choose the most deserving victims and it won't be the Deplorables. Compulsory charity can't be any other way. Tribal loyalty or redemption will be served. Either way, traditional Americans are a problem to be solved and inaction leaves no fingerprints.
The CDC had one job. Virology. Other countries had reliable test kits ready to go, in sufficient quantity to be useful. The technology is decades old yet the "renowned" CDC managed to botch it. The CDC distributed excuses and promises. N95 masks? Ventilators? Um, no. Maybe eventually, their Top Men are working on it. Somehow they always have plenty of everything to "fight the epidemic of obesity and racism" but not enough to perform their mandate. The CDC is useless and incompetent, an 11 billion dollar scam, benefiting no one except otherwise unemployable social activists.
Meanwhile, Russia is shipping nine planeloads of medics and surplus equipment and supplies to Italy, including ventilators.
I am a little bit wondering when widespread disorder will begin? No doubt it is just around the corner. With over three million wage earners laid off of their jobs last week, it is inevitable. I will reiterate what I have been saying all along. It is going to get a lot worse before it gets any better. God help all of you people that live in big cities. The world a year from now will be far different from the world of December of 2019. That is a fact, best to get used to it.
Got food? Ammo? Meds? It's too late now to prepare adequately for the pandemic much less the impending derailment of civilization itself. Preppers were calmly topping off their stashes in early January, at regular prices, in any quantity with lots-o'-choices. They saw the foreshadow of this emergency and acted appropriately. Prepping always looks crazy until the rug gets pulled. Paranoia is a survival tool, panic is not.
Systems are visibly collapsing. The stock market is out-crashing the 1929 debacle in both speed and depth. "No Admittance" signs are posted at hospitals and needed surgeries are being cancelled. Police aren't responding to anything less then a murder in progress. Cities are opening the prison doors and chasing off the inmates. Food wholesalers were cleaned out in a fortnight and many can't restock enough to matter. Others have stopped answering their phones.
Guns and ammo are selling at a record rate. Dealers say even anti-gun leftists are buying 'em. No one will say it, but it won't take much scarcity for the perpetual EBT Diversity to go where the food and supplies are. It's just there they'll meet real resistance for the first time in their lives. The suburbs have learned their family freezers are worth more than social posing. Unlike the stock market, price discovery will be utterly reliable when it comes to fried chicken and a six pack.
Our Open Borders Diversities already clog the ER and get it all for free because you're paying their bills. Activists will choose the most deserving victims and it won't be the Deplorables. Compulsory charity can't be any other way. Tribal loyalty or redemption will be served. Either way, traditional Americans are a problem to be solved and inaction leaves no fingerprints.
The CDC had one job. Virology. Other countries had reliable test kits ready to go, in sufficient quantity to be useful. The technology is decades old yet the "renowned" CDC managed to botch it. The CDC distributed excuses and promises. N95 masks? Ventilators? Um, no. Maybe eventually, their Top Men are working on it. Somehow they always have plenty of everything to "fight the epidemic of obesity and racism" but not enough to perform their mandate. The CDC is useless and incompetent, an 11 billion dollar scam, benefiting no one except otherwise unemployable social activists.
Meanwhile, Russia is shipping nine planeloads of medics and surplus equipment and supplies to Italy, including ventilators.
I am a little bit wondering when widespread disorder will begin? No doubt it is just around the corner. With over three million wage earners laid off of their jobs last week, it is inevitable. I will reiterate what I have been saying all along. It is going to get a lot worse before it gets any better. God help all of you people that live in big cities. The world a year from now will be far different from the world of December of 2019. That is a fact, best to get used to it.
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This is only one of many reasons why I have zero desire to live in a big city. For me, the ideal is to be within a reasonable distance from a city, but on the outskirts. And by "outskirts," I mean several miles away.
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7,728 Posts
So when all computers, printers and internet capable devices are seized in order to manage the dissemination of information, will that be a problem?
When all Churches Buildings are closed and preaching of sermons is prohibited, will that be a problem?
When your bank accounts are seized and all of your savings, retirement funds and pension funds seize for use by the Government, will that be a problem?
When all privately owned firearms and ammunition are prohibited and seized, will that be a problem?
When the quartering of Federal Troops is imposed upon you in your own home at your expense, will that be a problem?
When "Them The Government" decides that where you live, the size of your home and your ownership of personal belongings doesn't fall within their guidelines so they forcibly relocate you based on their whims, will that be a problem?
When "Them The Government" decides that you're too old, fat, infirm, or handicapped to receive medical care, food, clothing or shelter, will that be a problem?
For anyone who thinks that none of then above can or will happen, you're either blind, willfully ignorant, or you're lying to yourself and others.
It's happening now.
One small incremental step at a time and it's happening all over the world.
That we're letting it happen in America is a crying shame.
Edited to add: I started advocating months ago that we should totally QUARANTINE all traffic to and from Communist China and to and from any Nation that didn't have a Quarantine in place with the Chi-Coms.
I, like President Trump was accused of being racist.
Quarantining one state from another is totally ineffective and UnConstitional.
Initiating a Quarantine to stop the infection from coming from another Country would have done nothing to infringe upon the Rights of Americans.
But WAY too much money is made off Cruise Ships and Air Travel so "Them The Government" didn't want to shut down that money pipeline.
Now we're going to pay for that greedy shortsightedness.
Anecdotally, my Dads VA appointment for his Oncologist was cancelled. It has not been re-scheduled at this time.
What do you think cancellations like that are going to do to elderly Veterans dealing with chronic health issues?
When all Churches Buildings are closed and preaching of sermons is prohibited, will that be a problem?
When your bank accounts are seized and all of your savings, retirement funds and pension funds seize for use by the Government, will that be a problem?
When all privately owned firearms and ammunition are prohibited and seized, will that be a problem?
When the quartering of Federal Troops is imposed upon you in your own home at your expense, will that be a problem?
When "Them The Government" decides that where you live, the size of your home and your ownership of personal belongings doesn't fall within their guidelines so they forcibly relocate you based on their whims, will that be a problem?
When "Them The Government" decides that you're too old, fat, infirm, or handicapped to receive medical care, food, clothing or shelter, will that be a problem?
For anyone who thinks that none of then above can or will happen, you're either blind, willfully ignorant, or you're lying to yourself and others.
It's happening now.
One small incremental step at a time and it's happening all over the world.
That we're letting it happen in America is a crying shame.
Edited to add: I started advocating months ago that we should totally QUARANTINE all traffic to and from Communist China and to and from any Nation that didn't have a Quarantine in place with the Chi-Coms.
I, like President Trump was accused of being racist.
Quarantining one state from another is totally ineffective and UnConstitional.
Initiating a Quarantine to stop the infection from coming from another Country would have done nothing to infringe upon the Rights of Americans.
But WAY too much money is made off Cruise Ships and Air Travel so "Them The Government" didn't want to shut down that money pipeline.
Now we're going to pay for that greedy shortsightedness.
Anecdotally, my Dads VA appointment for his Oncologist was cancelled. It has not been re-scheduled at this time.
What do you think cancellations like that are going to do to elderly Veterans dealing with chronic health issues?
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13,761 Posts
I appreciate although don't agree with your analysis in par-1...The outrage at being amazed about people here is pretty meaningless though, if you were truly outraged you would go petition somewhere or start a lawsuit. They already quarantined a town in NY called New Rochelle -600 people, so you have plenty of reason to take your outrage and do some good...I'm not trying to "single" you out per se, but I do find it amazing the amount of outrage people use on this forum to replace rational discussion about the law, albeit usually gun law.
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13,761 Posts
Agree.
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13,761 Posts
It is like the next Civil War threads, a bunch of outraged internet participants telling everyone how brave they are and doing nothing about it but waiving a fist in the air. It is comic relief though. I've always found after 60+ years of human interaction that (generally, some exceptions of course), the ones who do the most threatening actually do the least when the "beeper" goes off.
So lets keep the "Outrage" at others out of this discussion (we can save it for the next-"Next Civil War" thread ;-) - there is always another one) and get back to discussing the issue on the merits. It makes for a much more interesting discussion vs comparison's of who is the most outraged.
So lets keep the "Outrage" at others out of this discussion (we can save it for the next-"Next Civil War" thread ;-) - there is always another one) and get back to discussing the issue on the merits. It makes for a much more interesting discussion vs comparison's of who is the most outraged.
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POTUS may come out with the NYC/part of CT/NJ lockdown today and then again he may not if he gets a lot of push back...Cuomo, who although supported the New Rachelle lock-down in NY, doesn't support a total NYC lock-down. So anyone who is against it can donate to Cumo's lawsuit if POTUS follow's through. Great way to manifest your outrage.
It seems easy for you to pontificate while talking out both sides of your mouth, ie, cracks about felony’s for NY,NJ. The fact is, as combat auto posted,kindly refute this
https://www.cdc.gov/quarantine/aboutlawsregulationsquarantineisolation.html ). the cdc has the authority, which goes toward containment and reducing the potential spread of the virus. Its far and away different than instantly taking away someone’s God given right to protect themselves under 2A. The other fact is, This is ALL about the economics, and how long can this country be effectively shut down. If you believe that theres no value in reading the data and (according to you) constitutionally allow people to roam free like nothing happened, then say so. Im in the hospital everyday putting myself and family at risk and have done so for 30+ years regardless of the current epidemic, pandemic or problem. So,why dont you go to your local hospital and volunteer..(and leave your mask and gloves off)21 - 40 of 64 Posts
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