Self Defense Scenario… Actually Happened to Me!
Self Defense Scenario… Actually Happened to Me!
I have only been reading these posts for a short time and I was wondering what you think about the scenario that happened to me, up front, close and in person.
Early one morning I was leaving the vicinity of an establishment that serves alcohol accompanied by my very intoxicated wife and another equally intoxicated female friend. (For the record I had not been drinking at any stage of the evening, I was the designated driver and caretaker.)
Apparently inside the establishment, on the occasions when I had been getting drinks for my companions, my wife had been propositioned several times. She declined the propositions and did not think enough of it to tell me…. (A mistake we now realize).
Leaving the establishment I was in Condition ‘Orange’. Escorting to very ‘happy’ ladies out at closing time is a good time to up ones conditional awareness. As we walked to the vehicle in a nearby parking lot I noticed a group of young males, observing me closely they had exited the establishment a little behind myself. Out of the corner of my eye I kept tabs on them as they moved parallel to our course. There were at this stage only 5-6. As we headed to the parking structure I became aware that they had met with several more young males (approx. 6-8) and were now, in my opinion, heading to intercept us. Four had run ahead to cut us off. Condition color looked set to change! I immediately made my wife and our friend aware of the potential for danger at this point. Which seemed to sober them up very quickly!! I saw that we were able to reach the car before they could reach us but that getting everyone inside would be the problem.
Reaching the vehicle it was obvious that they were targeting myself and my female companions. Realization of threat level greatly increased reaching the vehicle. My wife was able to quickly enter the passenger side of the vehicle with the keys. Realizing that I was in danger of getting caught entering the vehicle and possible trapped or pinned by the door I elected to command my wife to start the vehicle and procure my weapon from where I had it stored in the vehicle passenger compartment. At this time I was not currently in the possession of a CCW (I do not live in a ‘shall’ issue state yet). The state law however makes provision for the carrying of a loaded (chambered) handgun in the vehicle for the purpose of protecting persons and property.
At this time the closest assailant was only 8-10 feet away. Before I was able to actually take my weapon in hand (an HK USP Compact in .40 S&W loaded with 165grain Corbons), I was struck by an assailant just above the left eye, no warning no communication. The blow, luckily, was glancing and did not compromise my eyesight or balance. The assailant “struck and ran” back to the safety of his group. I now had the weapon in hand and both women were (mostly) in the vehicle. The assailants were positioned around my side (drivers) of the vehicle in a semi-circle. Scan count 12-16. The firearm was along side my right thigh, I had disengaged the safety on pickup and carry in condition 1. At this stage I gave verbal commands exhorting the members of the group to “Back up!!” They responded in a language I do not understand (I am being vague here on specific details to eliminate any future problems and potential identification). Several of the group then began to approach me. Fearing at this point for my life (remember I had been struck already and was bleeding from a cut to the eyebrow, there were also 12-16) I took the handgun from behind my thigh to the ready position. Safety is off at this stage finger outside trigger guard. Unfortunately seeing the handgun did not cause them to run, as I had hoped, like scared rabbits. I bought the weapon to target on the closest and placed finger inside the trigger guard, (my reasoning that they maybe armed and any reach for a weapon would have to be eliminated immediately, if I was to engage 12-16 possible targets). I had moved (side step) closer to the back of the vehicle away from the drivers open door to cut down the possibility that rounds directed at me might enter the vehicle and endanger my wife sitting in the passengers seat. In a second she had the vehicle started and seeing no point in remaining and entering into a dialogue, I covered the group finger still in guard while I entered the vehicle and got it in motion with the door open and sped quickly from the scene. The women were shaken and I sustained a cut to the left eye. Yes I had the intention of firing or I never would have bought the weapon to ready, any hostile movement at this point would have been reacted to with double shots to the torso. No further movement on their part no lead flinging on mine.
The epilogue is not essential to this defensive carry part of the story.
Thanks for your attention.
How did I do? Tips, suggestions, comments, all greatly encouraged.
Love this forum. It restores my faith in the human population.
I am,
Concerned Non-Citizen
------------------
"Both the oligarch and the tyrant mistrust the people, and therefore deprive them of their arms."
- Aristotle, "Politics"
I have only been reading these posts for a short time and I was wondering what you think about the scenario that happened to me, up front, close and in person.
Early one morning I was leaving the vicinity of an establishment that serves alcohol accompanied by my very intoxicated wife and another equally intoxicated female friend. (For the record I had not been drinking at any stage of the evening, I was the designated driver and caretaker.)
Apparently inside the establishment, on the occasions when I had been getting drinks for my companions, my wife had been propositioned several times. She declined the propositions and did not think enough of it to tell me…. (A mistake we now realize).
Leaving the establishment I was in Condition ‘Orange’. Escorting to very ‘happy’ ladies out at closing time is a good time to up ones conditional awareness. As we walked to the vehicle in a nearby parking lot I noticed a group of young males, observing me closely they had exited the establishment a little behind myself. Out of the corner of my eye I kept tabs on them as they moved parallel to our course. There were at this stage only 5-6. As we headed to the parking structure I became aware that they had met with several more young males (approx. 6-8) and were now, in my opinion, heading to intercept us. Four had run ahead to cut us off. Condition color looked set to change! I immediately made my wife and our friend aware of the potential for danger at this point. Which seemed to sober them up very quickly!! I saw that we were able to reach the car before they could reach us but that getting everyone inside would be the problem.
Reaching the vehicle it was obvious that they were targeting myself and my female companions. Realization of threat level greatly increased reaching the vehicle. My wife was able to quickly enter the passenger side of the vehicle with the keys. Realizing that I was in danger of getting caught entering the vehicle and possible trapped or pinned by the door I elected to command my wife to start the vehicle and procure my weapon from where I had it stored in the vehicle passenger compartment. At this time I was not currently in the possession of a CCW (I do not live in a ‘shall’ issue state yet). The state law however makes provision for the carrying of a loaded (chambered) handgun in the vehicle for the purpose of protecting persons and property.
At this time the closest assailant was only 8-10 feet away. Before I was able to actually take my weapon in hand (an HK USP Compact in .40 S&W loaded with 165grain Corbons), I was struck by an assailant just above the left eye, no warning no communication. The blow, luckily, was glancing and did not compromise my eyesight or balance. The assailant “struck and ran” back to the safety of his group. I now had the weapon in hand and both women were (mostly) in the vehicle. The assailants were positioned around my side (drivers) of the vehicle in a semi-circle. Scan count 12-16. The firearm was along side my right thigh, I had disengaged the safety on pickup and carry in condition 1. At this stage I gave verbal commands exhorting the members of the group to “Back up!!” They responded in a language I do not understand (I am being vague here on specific details to eliminate any future problems and potential identification). Several of the group then began to approach me. Fearing at this point for my life (remember I had been struck already and was bleeding from a cut to the eyebrow, there were also 12-16) I took the handgun from behind my thigh to the ready position. Safety is off at this stage finger outside trigger guard. Unfortunately seeing the handgun did not cause them to run, as I had hoped, like scared rabbits. I bought the weapon to target on the closest and placed finger inside the trigger guard, (my reasoning that they maybe armed and any reach for a weapon would have to be eliminated immediately, if I was to engage 12-16 possible targets). I had moved (side step) closer to the back of the vehicle away from the drivers open door to cut down the possibility that rounds directed at me might enter the vehicle and endanger my wife sitting in the passengers seat. In a second she had the vehicle started and seeing no point in remaining and entering into a dialogue, I covered the group finger still in guard while I entered the vehicle and got it in motion with the door open and sped quickly from the scene. The women were shaken and I sustained a cut to the left eye. Yes I had the intention of firing or I never would have bought the weapon to ready, any hostile movement at this point would have been reacted to with double shots to the torso. No further movement on their part no lead flinging on mine.
The epilogue is not essential to this defensive carry part of the story.
Thanks for your attention.
How did I do? Tips, suggestions, comments, all greatly encouraged.
Love this forum. It restores my faith in the human population.
I am,
Concerned Non-Citizen
------------------
"Both the oligarch and the tyrant mistrust the people, and therefore deprive them of their arms."
- Aristotle, "Politics"
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Stupid people, stupid places, stupid things. The root of most problems.
Intoxicated people are, by definition, stupid at the time. Places where lots of stupid people hang around are stupid places. Most of the interactions in stupid places are stupid things.
Second guessing your reactions to the outside incident is the least important decision criteria in this scenario.
Intoxicated people are, by definition, stupid at the time. Places where lots of stupid people hang around are stupid places. Most of the interactions in stupid places are stupid things.
Second guessing your reactions to the outside incident is the least important decision criteria in this scenario.
Joined
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2,876 Posts
You did well. Your story illustrates various aspects of points many people don't realize. That is, goblins don't always act in a rational manner. If you pointed your gun at them and they were not impressed, you know you had big troubles. People who are mentally unbalanced (such as enraged), on drugs, or acting in a herd mentality (Oh, he has a gun, but he can't shoot all of us!), won't always respond in ways we would expect. We can't count on goblins being logical or using good reasoning when it comes to life or death issues.
Good advice above. Staying at a bar until closing time is a very bad move. I would always leave at least 1 hour before they close. Also, you may want to think about using the valet next time.
Ever thought about keeping a shotgun in the car? I don't know about your state's laws, but a nice pump gun would work great in such a situation.
Billy Ray
Ever thought about keeping a shotgun in the car? I don't know about your state's laws, but a nice pump gun would work great in such a situation.
Billy Ray
Joined
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252 Posts
AMEN!
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ME,WE!
He did the right thing. But the mentality of stay home I don't agree with. Why should decent people not go out and have a good time. Patriot was responsible. He didn't drink all night. Staying home is not the answer. If anything ask sucurity at the establishment to watch the parking lot while you goto your car. I will never not go out because of what some group of punks might do.
would have reported to police the encounter/etc to forstall other problems. If i want to go out it is not incumbent for me to leave before i want just to prevent possible hostilities - if you give in then the terrorists have won. that said i have a ccw and i make a point of not engaging in conflicts as you never know hwat will/can happen - i think this episode was handled in an adult reasoned manner
Patriot,
I think you did just fine. Theres no way I'd ever try to second guess a person's actions since I wasnt there. Seems to me that by your account you acted very responsible. And I agree with BobbyT aND JWP, Living in fear and letting the goblins of this world control you're actions and how you live your life is like giving up part of the freedom of living in this great country. I would have done thesame thing as you. Be well,
01paw
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"The only reason a warrior is alive is to fight, and the only reason a warrior fights is to win. Otherwise, why be a warrior? Its easier to count beads."-Miyamoto Musashi
I think you did just fine. Theres no way I'd ever try to second guess a person's actions since I wasnt there. Seems to me that by your account you acted very responsible. And I agree with BobbyT aND JWP, Living in fear and letting the goblins of this world control you're actions and how you live your life is like giving up part of the freedom of living in this great country. I would have done thesame thing as you. Be well,
01paw
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"The only reason a warrior is alive is to fight, and the only reason a warrior fights is to win. Otherwise, why be a warrior? Its easier to count beads."-Miyamoto Musashi
I have to agree with how you handeled this situation. I have been lucky enuff not to have ever been forced to actually show my gun. (but I have been in situations where I made [email protected]## shure they knew I was reaching for somthing) fortunitly that was enuff to solve the problem. I beleve you could not have handeled the situation any better.
This post brings up lots of good points and things to think about.
First, the fact that no one was hurt seriously and all left with their lives is a testament to a responsible gun owner.
Second, I'm glad to hear that at least one person in the group was designated driver/caretaker. If you were all drunk...well, it didn't happen and lets not give that anymore thought!
Third, in the event that you would have to discharge your firearm, the 10 round magazine limit would have seriously hampered your defensive capability. If you had double-tapped each one, you would have to re-load half way through... I don't like that idea. That's one of the reasons I invested in the Hi Power. I can get 17 round South African mags...
Anyway, I think that you did well. There are some things that you could have done different, but I'm just glad to hear that you lived through the ordeal!
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"Your suffering will be legendary, even in HELL!!"
-- Pinhead, Hellraiser
First, the fact that no one was hurt seriously and all left with their lives is a testament to a responsible gun owner.
Second, I'm glad to hear that at least one person in the group was designated driver/caretaker. If you were all drunk...well, it didn't happen and lets not give that anymore thought!
Third, in the event that you would have to discharge your firearm, the 10 round magazine limit would have seriously hampered your defensive capability. If you had double-tapped each one, you would have to re-load half way through... I don't like that idea. That's one of the reasons I invested in the Hi Power. I can get 17 round South African mags...
Anyway, I think that you did well. There are some things that you could have done different, but I'm just glad to hear that you lived through the ordeal!
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"Your suffering will be legendary, even in HELL!!"
-- Pinhead, Hellraiser
Not trying to second guess anyone, however everyone one should realize that **** happens in bars. If one is going to party in bars, expect problems.
This is a personal choice, and I have made mine.
Indiana has no rules about guns and places that serve adult beverages, however as I always carry, I never go into bars. If on the road, I want a drink, I buy the beverage and take it to my room. My choice. GLV
This is a personal choice, and I have made mine.
Indiana has no rules about guns and places that serve adult beverages, however as I always carry, I never go into bars. If on the road, I want a drink, I buy the beverage and take it to my room. My choice. GLV
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