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Discussion Starter · #1 · (Edited)
While guns allow a person to do harm to people from a distance and in larger numbers I do not feel edged weapons should be over looked nor underestimated both in terms of being used against you & being used for you.

Knives for example have many tactical advatages such as they are easily concealed, can be drawn very quickly, take practically no training to use & are silent, excellent ambush weapons just to mention a few.

Edged weapon wounds to nonvital areas are way more devastating than bullets.

If anyone doubts this simple google the pdf file called "contact edged weapon wounds" but be warned, it's very graphic but proves the point.

I guess I was curious the thoughts of others on edged weapons & do you train with them, watch those who have a blade clipped on thier pocket etc.

If you say you never think of your knife as a weapon, that sure doesn't mean the BGs doesn't think of his as one.

Just being aware of them is the first defense against them.
 

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While guns allow a person to do harm to people from a distance and in larger numbers I do not feel edged weapons should be over looked nor underestimated both in terms of being used against you & being used for you.
Agree

Knives for example have many tactical advatages such as they are easily concealed, can be drawn very quickly, take practically no training to use & are silent, excellent ambush weapons just to mention a few.
For the most part I agree except with the no training portion. Most folks that I have observed fighting with a knife actually leave themselves very exposed to a counter move without even realizing it.

Edged weapon wounds to nonvital areas are way more devastating than bullets.

If anyone doubts this simple google the pdf file called "contact edged weapon wounds" but be warned, it's very graphic but proves the point.
I'll take you word on this one even I have seen some pretty nasty non-vital wounding thanks to gunfire:)

I guess I was curious the thoughts of others on edged weapons & do you train with them, watch those who have a blade clipped on thier pocket etc.

If you say you never think of your knife as a weapon, that sure doesn't mean the BGs doesn't think of his as one.

Just being aware of them is the first defense against them.
I always make a point of always being situationally aware of those around me and what they might possibly be carrying. With that said I rarely carry a knife of any sorts nowadays unless I'm hunting. I guess I carried enough in the military that I just prefer not too anymore:biglaugh:. However it is a very rare day when I do not have one of my .45's on me:). For those that want to carry an edge weapon I say go for it. But like any other weapon it takes practice and familiarity to be confident and effective with it. My personal experience with sticking another person with a knife is not something I ever hope to have to repeat. But as you have pointed out, the bad guys won't have any issue with that at all.

Regards,
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
DivePanama,

I think I came off wrong about the training part. (you are right)

A lot of "training" that many teach is two guys squared off and some 10 step BS out of the movies type stuff.

In reality a person probably doesn't even know he is in a knife fight until he has been stabbed.

Again though, you are right, good training would be a plus.
 

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I've talked to a few people who have training in knives, and one thing they've always told me was that while training was a definite plus, when it comes to a knife fight, your chances (regardless of training) are 50% at best

I carry a knife when traveling in the car for emergencies, but otherwise it's a .45 for me due to the faster draw :)
 

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Have trained with knives although not extensively. My .45 and my Emerson CQC-7 never leave my hip, and I feel naked if I'm missing either.
 

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I've carried a knife of some sort for 50 years. Wouldn't leave home without it. I carry a Benchmade 9100 (auto). Best knife I've ever handled. I use it for everything. If the time ever comes where it's life or death I won't be fumbling around, I know exactly where it is, how it rides in my pocket, and with the slight slide of the lock and the press of a button I'm armed and dangerous. That being said I also always have a pistol on me also. I hope I'm never a mark, but if I am, I will be one of the perps least favorite targets of all time.:biglaugh:
 

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I'd NEVER bring a knife to gunfight but, there are guys out there that can stick you in the throat with one at 10 yards before you could draw a gun. Few, but they exists non the less.
 

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Had an edged weapons class in the Academy, martial arts instructor. He picked the big guy in the class, told him to draw his gun when he felt threatened. Facing each other 6 feet apart, doing a threshold inquiry no real perceived threat. The instructor takes two steps forward, as to "get in his face", but then with a Bic pen that was concealed in his hand, proceded to go down one side and up the other as the officer was retreating, trying to draw his weapon.

By the time the weapon came out the officer was back to the classroom wall.
The instructor then showed video of inmates "working out" in prision, honing their edged weapons skills.

A proven fact is that within 27 feet if a BG has a knife, you will most likely be cut, by the time you can fire your weapon. You never know who is standing next to you. Like your CCW is not public knowledge, a BG's knowledge and physical abilities are not posted anywhere. Many a "little guy" has handed the "big guy" his butt.
 

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Historically knives have been used by resistance fighters
to take fireams away from occupancy forces. The whole knife to a gunfight thing is fine in the movies were evil doers make dramatic speaches. In the real world you don't get warned...just stuck.

I've had a knife in my pocket for some 40 years. I live in Illinios of course I concider it a possible self defence weapon. Ever wonder why I own trained protection dogs?

I've done some hog hunting behind dogs, the fastest kills I've had & seen have been from a knife.
 

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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
Some interesting comments. I hope more weigh in with thoughts & opinions as well.

One thing I hear a lot but do not believe and that is if you use a knife you are likely to be cut.

That may be true if two people are squared off each with a knife, but I have noticed on many crime shows where someone is stabbed to death, rarely does the BG leave behind one of his own fingers or blood, even when he victim puts up a huge fight.

If OJ was guilty, that means he took out two people with only one very minor cut on his finger. (if I remember right)

Again, in most of these stories it's not some highly skilled knife fighter.

I carry a .45 from the time I get up til I go to bed & like some here I carry a knife weak side & sometime one strong side also.
 

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A large Ka-Bar TDI rides on my trouser belt under my mag pouch on the left side for its designed purpose, weapon retention and last ditch. I sometimes have it on when out and about off work. Other times I carry a small sheath knife in the same place when in civies. Sometimes a Case Russlock in a pocket and have my hand on it if I feel the need.

I have a Kershaw 1550 assisted opener, but I don't carry it anymore. Folders, even assisted openers can still take too long to get into action. You also have that thing about fine motor skills taking a hike when you need them.

I may not always be at my peak and functioning with the "honed awareness and reactions" needed for mall ninjahood, but I do try to take into account the possibility of edged weapons when others are around. Just like you should anticipate a kick in the treasure chest (where those family jewels are stored) and be ready to move a leg into the line of strike, the possibility of a knife being employed against you should become part of your nature. Think dirty and sneaky, then expect it. Return the compliment.

Consider your gun and knife as a combo. I take into account that if at work something goes south in up close and personal quarters, I may turn my firearms side away, covering the gun with one hand, while going to town with the TDI for my first strikes, then backing for the draw and fire. My thinking is that most people would expect you to go for your gun regardless. If it's touching distance then the sudden eruption of violence with the knife in your off hand may give you and advantage.

Sure, it would be great if I could just bark an order to get away to anyone who moves into my declared space, but I can't do that. So people sometimes end up closer around me than I am comfortable with.

Edged weapons don't jam. You may fumble the draw and opening of your folder, but something to cut and stick with makes a good part of a backup plan. You may not be able to get to that BUG, if you even have, or are permitted to carry one. Being able to do a little slashing might give you the time and space to get to your BUG.
 

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Amos has it right...gun AND knife together.

can't find it at the moment..but there were some great police training vids on line that show examples of guy with knife chargin officer...even with the officer trainee knowing what the drill is and the 'bad guy' at 15 feet..both hands at their side...the knife wins every time before an officer can draw and fire to stop.
I may have a draw problem or a jam, or have it wrestled from me..or simpy run out of ammo before I stop the threat that is upon me.. I'll take a good blade over my fists, or in conjunction with them, anyday.

Amos also makes a great point..even my instructores all carry assisted folders..yet unless you are going to really practice with those and clip or pocket them where you can really get them into the fight quickly..you best consider a straight blade....
 

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I usually carry a gerber 4" evo non serated as well as my gun. Autos are not legal here so that one is out for me. Rather have a well made randall but I will not 2nd mortgage my house for one!
 

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1SG’s school of edged weapons

OK. Here is your two minute knife fighting class; as taught to me by an old ex SAS guy.

Hold your knife in a fencing grip, not like an ice pick.

Get in a good stance, distributing your weight evenly on both feet.

Lower your center of gravity, crouch just a bit.

Move the knife in a horizontal figure eight movement; for you brainy folks that’s the infinity symbol.

Now for the most important part.

Move very expeditiously in the opposite direction; continuing to move the knife in that figure eight movement behind you hopefully keeping the other idiot further than arms length away so he can’t cut you.


:)
 

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I'd NEVER bring a knife to gunfight but, there are guys out there that can stick you in the throat with one at 10 yards before you could draw a gun. Few, but they exists non the less.
People always makes this claim...I'd like to see them try. Nobody every thinks about the fact that they too could run away from this person.

Let's say that the knife-weilding crook who intends to do you harm is an Olympic sprinter who can cover that ground in 1 second from a standstill. He isn't, he's likely a drug using jerk, but for the sake of arguement we'll go with it. Now, you see this person coming after you and you're able to take 2 steps back making the distance has has to cover 13-16yds before he gets to you. This will mean you will have 1.3-1.6 seconds to draw your gun and deliver an aimed (or pointed?) shot. I know I can do it. I bet you can too. If you can't, time to find a new concealed carry rig.
 

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on the edge

Don't get into knife fights. Guns, sticks, table legs, staplers... anything but knives.

I carry a Benchmade Griptillian.

Mainly, I carry it as as an all-purpose cutting tool.

As a weapon, I would prefer to use it as a bludgeon. The grip body is large enough that I can put my thumb over top and hammer with the pointier end. If there is still fight in the BG after smashing it into his face and head a few times, maybe I'll throw out the blade. Maybe. I'll probably just smash an eye socket, windpipe or nose... and run away. If I have to fight, then I'm just looking for an opening to retrieve a better weapon. Break a table leg off, pick up something...

I think the key is in taking a wholistic approach to combat. Use everything to your advantage, with a fury, in whatever way works best. Using a knife as a bludgeon means you don't have to worry about cutting yourself. A rock is better than a fist. A gun is better than a knife. A warrior's mindset is, pound-for-pound, a better asset than any of these things.

All things considered, I would still prefer to use my 1911... even as a bludgeon.
 

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For a defensive weapon a knife is too quiet. I want that thing to make a lot of noise to alert the police, 911 and the doctor. It is quiet which is good for taking care of an enemy sentry.
Not as good for self-defense in the civilian world.

A knife is better than no weapon at all, but if you're throat is cut in an unexpected attack, you're out of the fight in seconds. Two guys in the classic Hollywood knife fight duel and both are going to be cut up, both may die.

The tactical advantage goes to the guy who attacks first and a bigger knife helps [heads fall off when a Bowie or Katana strike the neck.
 

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A rock is better than a fist. A gun is better than a knife.
And the front bumper of a truck trumps all of them :biglaugh:

I think if a knife is to truely be effective, it must be used as a stealth weapon, up close & very personal.

If you want an eye openner watch one of those Prison documetarys that run on cable. The surveilence CCTV vedio offers a real world view to the topic. Most of those stabbing victums never know what's just happened.
 
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