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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I'm still pretty new to guns, but as of lately, I've been handling quite a few, dry firing the majority of them. What I've come to realize is that a lot of guns have got a pretty decent trigger pull. Lever action, single action, autoloaders, my AR-9, etc...

Recently, I've gotten a chance to handle a S&W CSX and a Knighthawk custom. The gun store allowed me to handle and dry fire both, though I have to admit that handling the $4500 Knighthawk was a tiny bit nerve racking. My conclusion was the Knighthawk certainly was a smother operating gun with a lighter trigger pull, and was a thousand times prettier, I still didn't see how the extra lb or so from the CSX would make any difference to me. While I haven't actually fired them, I think that I would be as accurate with either of them since both trigger pulls seemed rather clean and crisp.

I bring this up because I've heard a lot of criticism of the CSX's trigger, it being too heavy and such. I can't help but think that this maybe one of the guns manufactured after whatever issues were fixed. Maybe? Or maybe the light trigger pull I feel is a lot harder on the trigger snobs than on me?

Maybe it's because I'm a stronger than most people. The gun with the heaviest trigger pull I've ever felt was from my H&R Model 900 22lr revolver; which must be 20+ pounds. But still, I managed a pretty good group considering that the gutter sights were mangled by a grinder (really need to JB Weld a picanny rail on that thing and put on a cheap, chinese red dot).

The 2nd worse was my 30-30 Winchester, with the trigger safety. But it only needed a bit of oiling and now it's the 3rd behind my cursed SCCY CPX2.

Now, I can kinda understand the trigger snobs out there, the ones that absolutely need to have a lighter, smooth, crisp trigger pull. After all, I've dried fired a double action and after about 20 or so consecutive pulls, your finger gets pretty tired. But I can only understand up to a point. A light, crisp trigger pull does allow you to keep pulling that trigger without much effort, but many trigger snobs complain about trigger pulls that don't seem bad at all, IMO.

I see all kinds of AR triggers for sale, some costing hundreds of dollars promising a much lighter, smoother pull, all the while I'm thinking that my milspec Anderson trigger is just perfect as is. Yeah, it's a little bit heavier than my wife's 380 EZ, but it's still light and crisp enough for me and my wife to be very accurate. Fact is that I absolutely love it.

The only thing I demand from my trigger is consistency. Without that, I can't hit a very good group at all.

The reason I bring this up is because I've seen a lot of trigger snobs criticize guns that don't seem like bad guns, like maybe (keyword "maybe") the CSX. But I'm keeping an open mind. After all, I've only handled a sample of one. I've also only had a sample of one SCCY and that was a pretty bad sample, yet so many people rave about them.
 

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Thanks for the review on the CSX trigger. I have read bad reviews about the CSX trigger also so I went to the closest Cabela's to check one out. After waiting 30 minutes for another customer to rack the slide on every S&W striker gun they had in their cases (twice) I finally got to handle one. Cabela's now has trigger locks on all their guns and won't remove them to allow dry firing. Really anymore when I go to Cabelas to look at guns they really don't need humans behind the gun counter.
 

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I've read two articles on the CSX recently (in paper magazines). One stated that the trigger wasn't very nice, and if I remember correctly about 6.5 pounds. The other said it was 6 pounds and pretty nice. I bet after a thousand rounds each would drop by half a pound and smooth up to be very usable.

I definitely prefer a nice trigger, but don't have any trouble shooting good groups with average trigger. I recently picked up a 4" M&P 2.0 Compact, and after about 100 rounds, the striker is released after a hair under 5.5 pounds. The takeup is still kinda gritty, and the release isn't exactly crisp, but it still works well. I was actually shooting it more like a double action revolver in slow precise fire during the last session, than by taking up the slack and then completing the trigger press in two stages. I've had another of the same model for a few years, and shoot it better than expected considering the prices I paid for them.....last one was under $400 shipped.

I'm actually somewhat interested in the CSX. enough that I scoured the Internet looking for real world pricing. I found one in a Scheels a couple months ago, but gave up on waiting for a sales associate to come back to open the case.
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
I've read two articles on the CSX recently (in paper magazines). One stated that the trigger wasn't very nice, and if I remember correctly about 6.5 pounds. The other said it was 6 pounds and pretty nice. I bet after a thousand rounds each would drop by half a pound and smooth up to be very usable.

I definitely prefer a nice trigger, but don't have any trouble shooting good groups with average trigger. I recently picked up a 4"M&P 2.0 Compact, and after about 100 rounds, the striker is released after a hair under 5.5 pounds. The takeup is still kinda gritty, and the release isn't exactly crisp, but it still works well. I was actually shooting it more like a double action revolver in slow precise fire during the last session, than by taking up the slack and then completing the trigger press in two stages.

I'm actually somewhat interested in the CSX. enough that I scoured the Internet looking for real world pricing.
The price at my local gun shop was $550. Not bad. I've promised myself one for Christmas. :cool:
 

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That's pretty much the lowest price I found on the Internet (from places I've used before), so it's very competitive. I think the price tag was upside down on the one from Scheels. Honestly, I was mostly wanting to see it in order to dry fire it.
 

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One more thing I noticed about the CSX. I have very large hands and the grip on the CSX was only long enough to fit half my hand. Maybe if the trigger didn't have a lock on it and I could have put my finger on the trigger to better judge the grip.
 

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..... and a Knighthawk custom. ....$4500 Knighthawk was a tiny bit nerve racking. .... Knighthawk ....
I agree, I think that guys at Nighthawk should be by now knighted for their contribution to the world of 1911. .

As far as triggers are concerned, "snobbery" is a bad term, too non-descript. There are use requirements, there are user requirements, there are user preferences, and there is a user dependency, and this has been talked about more than enough. I don't know much about the CSX but I'd guess it has an adequate trigger for its intended use in hands of a non-dependent user.
 

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I looked at one at the LGS some time ago and the sales guy said it was S&W’s answer to the people who were in between a trigger gun and a striker fired gun. For a small gun it felt pretty good in my hand. I have not shot one so I can’t really give any input other than the texture and grip sure seemed to be better than a lot of other similar small guns and I think it had a metal frame? I think the gun they had on display had a retail of $600 or more. I don’t recall what the trigger felt like when I dry fired it though.
 

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This is one of the few instances when having small-ish hands is a benefit. A Shield’s 8 round magazine bottom is even with the end of my pinkie. The CSX didn’t seem that small through the glass…..I was surprised to read that it’s actually smaller than the Shield.


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With respect to the CSX specifically, mine breaks at 6 lb. The take up is smooth, the break is crisp. The 'problem' people complain about most is the click and reset sensation you get just a smidge before the trigger bar resets on the sear. It's a bad breath distance 'Oh sh*t!!' pistol, not a 50 yard target gun. You're not going to feel the trigger reset if you're having to use the gun for it's intended purpose. I would say the trigger is not only fit for purpose, but probably better than it needs to be - and better than most give it credit for.
 

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I know most triggers are decent enough but I'm still a trigger snob. After running my ar-9's with match triggers, now my mil-spec triggers feel like absolute garbage. I loved them before but it is what it is. There's no going back as far as I can see. Ammo is too expensive not to be running it through the best possible rig.
 

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You can get by without a perfect trigger or even a great one. But for the amount of money you're spending, as Zack mentioned, why not get the best possible outcome? Or, to go back to the old standby....True, you don't "need" a great trigger, but realistically, what does need have to do with any of it. If you want it, can find it, and can afford it, have fun.
 

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I'm still pretty new to guns.............

The reason I bring this up is because I've seen a lot of trigger snobs criticize guns that don't seem like bad guns, like maybe (keyword "maybe") the CSX. But I'm keeping an open mind. After all, I've only handled a sample of one. I've also only had a sample of one SCCY and that was a pretty bad sample, yet so many people rave about them.


You throw the term "snob" around quite a bit.







I've never known anyone to rave over SCCY, but then again, I don't believe all the glossy pictures & hype in magazines.






Perhaps you'll figure out a few things....maybe develop preferences and roll with those.

There are all sorts of tools for all sorts of jobs. Guns are tools.
 

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Discussion Starter · #15 ·
You throw the term "snob" around quite a bit.







I've never known anyone to rave over SCCY, but then again, I don't believe all the glossy pictures & hype in magazines.






Perhaps you'll figure out a few things....maybe develop preferences and roll with those.

There are all sorts of tools for all sorts of jobs. Guns are tools.
Yes I did. I also paired the term with a specific action, the criticizing of a gun that had a pretty dang decent trigger pull. That's what snobs do, belittle things that aren't to their high standards.

As for the SCCY, the one benefit I've had with owning and practicing with it is that I've become a better shot. Having to work with a long, somewhat heavy trigger pull has it's advantages. If you can manage to stay on target while pulling that trigger, then a short, single action trigger isn't a problem. My preference is to have the ability to be a good shot with just about any firearm. Practicing with a DAO trigger is one way to accomplish that.
 

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Yes I did. I also paired the term with a specific action, the criticizing of a gun that had a pretty dang decent trigger pull. That's what snobs do, belittle things that aren't to their high standards.

As for the SCCY, the one benefit I've had with owning and practicing with it is that I've become a better shot. Having to work with a long, somewhat heavy trigger pull has it's advantages. If you can manage to stay on target while pulling that trigger, then a short, single action trigger isn't a problem. My preference is to have the ability to be a good shot with just about any firearm. Practicing with a DAO trigger is one way to accomplish that.
One of the many draws of the 1911 is that the trigger can be tuned to be just about the best of any other model handgun. It’s a particular advantage for me given my shooting drills and use. That doesn’t make me a snob - which certainly isn’t a compliment.

You can enjoy any firearm that pleases you - as when it comes to taste there can never be an argument. But putting down others who appreciate a light and crisp trigger isn’t the way to go.

‘Nuff said.
 

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Take a novice shooter to the range with a variety of 9mm handguns. Glocks, TDA's, DAO, and a full size 1911. The 1911 will be the easiest for a novice to shoot well. I know this to be a fact because I have done it on numerous occasions. Why? The trigger, simple as that. no snobbery involved. It just happens to be the best and easiest to master. Try it sometime and see if it isn't true.
 

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I resent being labeled a snob by the OP, I appreciate a smooth light crisp trigger.

That is my prerogative, to each their own likes and dislikes as to trigger feel. If you are happy with mil spec AR triggers and run of the mill striker fired triggers good for you. There are many guns out there that should meet your requirements and are made for shooters just like you.

But don't label me or sling comments just because I have a different set of requirements for MY guns!!

I have a good friend that shoots Taurus Millennium pistols and shoots them well, and has liked them till he shot a variety of pistols at the Bash this year. He now shoots my 1911s by choice and has a EDC X9 on order from WC.

He has seen the light!!!

Shoot anything you like but don't hate on us that prefer and shoot guns with crisp triggers.

Happy Fathers Day
 

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Take a novice shooter to the range with a variety of 9mm handguns. Glocks, TDA's, DAO, and a full size 1911. The 1911 will be the easiest for a novice to shoot well. I know this to be a fact because I have done it on numerous occasions. Why? The trigger, simple as that. no snobbery involved. It just happens to be the best and easiest to master.
Yes, that's accurate, pun intended. Novice shooters are at the lowest level of shooting skill hierarchy. What's easiest for a novice to perform with is a questionable value yardstick. Easiest to master often times leads one to be only a master of the easiest. Novices, or not novices, who limit themselves to the easiest often times develop trigger control deficiencies and end up in a trigger dependent category mentioned earlier, and that is sad.
 

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Discussion Starter · #20 ·
Yes, that's accurate, pun intended. Novice shooters are at the lowest level of shooting skill hierarchy. What's easiest for a novice to perform with is a questionable value yardstick. Easiest to master often times leads one to be only a master of the easiest. Novices, or not novices, who limit themselves to the easiest often times develop trigger control deficiencies and end up in a trigger dependent category mentioned earlier, and that is sad.
Well, I'll have to admit, I'm still a novice.

That said, I know where my deficiencies are and it's not in my trigger pull, at least not as far as single action, consistent triggers go.

I still have a tendency to flinch when firing anything over 380 acp, my aim still wavers just a little because I haven't had enough practice (dry firing or otherwise) to develop the muscle control, and my accuracy past 15 yards without a scope still leaves a bit to be desired.

The only thing I have somewhat mastered is my trigger control, and that's because I practice a lot with heavy triggers, my 22lr revolver being the heaviest.

Why do I practice with heavy triggers? Because I have guns with them. It's simple as that. And 22lr is a very useful cartridge.

The only thing going for that revolver is that it's well broken in and the hammer always falls when it's supposed to, which is why I like it.
 
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