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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I found this in another firearms forum, it's the advice of someone who actually had to survive during Argentina's socio/economic collapse. Not the hypothetical musings of we who haven't experienced it.
It's long, about an hour to read the whole thing, but, in my opinion, worth every minute spent on it.
Parts

http://ferfal.blogspot.com/2008/10/thoughts-on-urban-survival-2005.html
 

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I guess it depends on what you consider "SHTF". In my opinion of course, there aren't going to be any people going to work every day during what I would consider SHTF days (chaos: invasion, total civil war, zombies), so carrying a rifle is choice if the situation warrants it. I think he misuses the phrase "SHTF" , as he seems to apply it to the aftermath and rebuilding periods in that country as well as the initial rioting. But that's just me though. People who think a handgun alone is just fine to defend yourself and your family during a true SHTF scenario can go ahead... I won't be. If my family has to evac and find a safer place by foot (or vehicle for a short time), my wife and I will both be carrying at least one rifle and pistol each.

What bothers me is that his country effectively dropped to 3rd world status in economy and violence levels (from 2nd world) for a few years (honestly, when you think "SHTF", do you also think about how it's going to be hard going to work at the burger joint every morning?), and insults people who obviously consider the poop hitting the fan akin to the lawlessness seen in Somalia in the early 90's.

What his writing describes to me is some good guidelines and advice to consider once we enter "The Great Depression 2".
 

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I didn't click on the link, but from another website discussing a SHTF scenario, the opinion was unanimous......a Revolver. Few things to go wrong or need to be replaced over time and easy to maintain.
 

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I didn't click on the link, but from another website discussing a SHTF scenario, the opinion was unanimous......a Revolver. Few things to go wrong or need to be replaced over time and easy to maintain.
Dunno about that one.
You ever looked inside a revolver? Lots of little parts in there.
If it were to start malfunctioning, due to being out of time, etc., I would be outta luck. I would have no idea how to fix it, even if I had the parts.
Anything that could go wrong with my AR, I could fix with spare parts, and rudimentary tools.
Plus, it is enough gun for both SD and hunting.

I guess I just disagree with the "easy to maintain" part.
Heck, there are even six(or five, or seven, or eight) chambers to clean.:)
 

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Dunno about that one.
You ever looked inside a revolver? Lots of little parts in there.
If it were to start malfunctioning, due to being out of time, etc., I would be outta luck. I would have no idea how to fix it, even if I had the parts.
Anything that could go wrong with my AR, I could fix with spare parts, and rudimentary tools.
Plus, it is enough gun for both SD and hunting.

I guess I just disagree with the "easy to maintain" part.
Heck, there are even six(or five, or seven, or eight) chambers to clean.:)
Well, things that can go wrong with a semi that a revolver simply does not have: magazine spring, recoil spring, extractor. I love 1911's and do not own any revolvers.....that being said, I do see the logic behind that thinking.
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
Interesting that you should say that shooterinpa. He says exactly the opposite. His recommendation is for a high capacity auto. Glock specifically, and by inference a .40.
His reasons make sense, you'd have to read it, but then I also don't trust revolvers.

He also says the old saw "A Handgun is only good for fighting your way back to your rifle" is not a reflection of the reality he has known. He says 90% of one's need for a firearm is a handgun, because you can take it everywhere concealed.
Anyway, he did recommend a FAL, but said the need for that is less common.
 

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Interesting that you should say that shooterinpa. He says exactly the opposite. His recommendation is for a high capacity auto. Glock specifically, and by inference a .40.
His reasons make sense, you'd have to read it, but then I also don't trust revolvers.

He also says the old saw "A Handgun is only good for fighting your way back to your rifle" is not a reflection of the reality he has known. He says 90% of one's need for a firearm is a handgun, because you can take it everywhere concealed.
Anyway, he did recommend a FAL, but said the need for that is less common.
The argument was made for the revolver in a SHTF scenario where one was forced to leave the home and carry only one weapon. In this case, there would be no chance to get recoil springs, new magazines etc. Like I said, I have 1911's and semi-autos, but no revolvers (yet).
 

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being america...decision factors tend to also consider things like having a pistol compatible with your local law enforecment in terms caliber, magazines, etc...or at least having a very popular product...
I agree , being able to keep a firearm concealed is a huge plus...but I'd also be quick to grab my mossberg 12ga pistol grip...saw the barrel a bit shorter..it'll ride in my back pack and I expect more homes to have a 12ga and ammo sitting around..should be able to pick up ammo on the run.

but, all that said, my biggest concern is the hunter with a decent 308..that guy could sit in the edge of my woods and wait for me to walk past a window or venture out of the house and he could pick me off from 200-500 yds and I'd never have a chance to fight...

bottom line I guess I'm saying any firearm in any kind of shtf can have it's advantages and you make do.
 

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Semiauto pistols and semiauto rifles, in government calibers.
 

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The argument was made for the revolver in a SHTF scenario where one was forced to leave the home and carry only one weapon. In this case, there would be no chance to get recoil springs, new magazines etc. Like I said, I have 1911's and semi-autos, but no revolvers (yet).
Yet again, this is totally hypothetical. The info in the link provided is real world experience, recent experience I might add. For those of you that don't know Argentina went through an economic collapse in 2001, we seem to be on a very similar path.

I have read info from FerFAL before on various blogs. I highly recommend his info for those of us that choose to prepare rather than depend on the preparations of others ie: Ants vs Grasshoppers.
 

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Yet again, this is totally hypothetical. The info in the link provided is real world experience, recent experience I might add. For those of you that don't know Argentina went through an economic collapse in 2001, we seem to be on a very similar path.

I have read info from FerFAL before on various blogs. I highly recommend his info for those of us that choose to prepare rather than depend on the preparations of others ie: Ants vs Grasshoppers.
I have read some people actually burying guns and ammo.

Two years ago, I would have called them nuts for doing this; now I think they are simply preparing for the inevitable.
 

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Collapse, to me it means EOTWAWKI. In that case it means a relatively light rifle (mid-length AR-15), a couple semi-autos (1911's or SIG's) and lots of ammo. I have piles of high-quality, mostly factory, mags for those arms. Then it's "Come-N-Get-Me".
 

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Well, the firearms should be just a piece of the greater SHTF plan. I personally intend to hunker down at the family farm with a water supply and farmland. A few long range rifles and a 12gauge riot gun are weapons of choice with a few different autoloading handguns in common calibers (9mm or .45 personally).

All things considered, for each person it would be different. You have to ask yourself a question and figure out how/when/where you are going to head. If you are going to have to travel a long ways on foot a light carbine in .223/5.56 and a few hundred rounds of ammo is going to be a lot better than a high powered bolt action rifle. If you are going to be stuck in the suburbs, build yourself a good shotgun (pump or SA depending on personal preference) with a mag extension to give yourself 6-8 rds of 12 gauge. With the 12gauge I would load the first couple rounds with slugs in hopes of engaging your target at a longer range (35-100yds...you'd just have to know your area) eventually switching to buckshot to keep them at bay. In theory you would want the 12 gauge being supported by armed family and friends with other weapons to create the best defensive position possible. Perhaps engaging targets at distance with a nice deer rifle or something first and eventually switching to the riot gun. If you live in the country and could see a threat for quite some distance, having multiple persons creating a killzone with high powered rifles or carbines at 350yds + might be nicer...or better yet find a good place to create an ambush quite some distance from home.

All things considered, I would not want to rely on handgun in any sort of EOTWAWKI scenario. A longgun is far and away a better weapon. If I did have to limit myself to one handgun, it would probably be my 1911 as it is what I'm the most practiced with and also what I have the most spare parts/ammo/mags for. If I was limiting myself to one gun period, my Rem 870 with 20" smoothbore slug barrel with magazine extension making it 7+1 would be my choice.
 

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Discussion Starter · #17 ·
And, of course, I'm looking for info for decision making towards a FAL, as this is not the first time I've heard it called the best overall survival rifle for these situations.
 

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+1 to what RickB posted, plus plenty of food and water............

Clyde
I'd also add the most common police caliber and some means of purifying water once your supply runs out.

Robert
 

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And, of course, I'm looking for info for decision making towards a FAL, as this is not the first time I've heard it called the best overall survival rifle for these situations.
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