I had to use an 18 1/2 lb. Wilson spring to control the brass. It goes about 10' now and can find it.

 

Definitely an underrated round, I love a well loaded 38.

 

I have shot and owned supers since the 70's and I still have a few and carry one daily.

It's def a reloader's cartridge because none can be found on shelves.

.38 SUPER, MY, 9mm. ⁹

 

I have shot and owned supers since the 70's and I still have a fee and carry one daily.

It's def a reloader's cartridge because none can be found on shelves.

.38 SUPER, MY, 9mm. ⁹

I actually found several variations at Bufflao Bore, the boutique ammo manufacturer, the make a 115gr jhp rated at 1450fps with an ME of 537ftlbs, a 147gr jhp at 1150fps and an ME of 432ftlbs and also a 124gr fmj at 1350fps and an ME of 502ftlbs. the balistics data was derived using a 5" 1911 and are damn right creapy teetering on the lower end of the .357 Mag ballistics. Their best test scenario was the 115gr from a 5" barrel and right at the bore it clocked at 1600fps with 653.6 ftlbs of ME, and even at 25 yards its still producing 555.4 ftlbs which is insane. My first job in LE i worked for this rinky dink 20 man dept, and i was issued a Smith 639 with 10,000 rounds through it and wood grips worn smooth lol, to add further insult to injury MY INJURY , they issue those ****ty 115gr winchester silver tips, which for comparisons sake had a whopping 382ftlbs of ME from the muzzle and was down to 300ftlbs at 50yards lol,

What i'd love to find is a 1911 in the rare 9x23 Winchester which makes a nice 505ftlbs with a 125 gr jhp

Check out Buffalo, they have some really hot loadings up near the limit

Buffalo Bore Ammunition | Strictly Business

Buffalo Bore Manufactures the finest high powered handgun, and rifle ammunition available.

www.buffalobore.com

 

still have my Lama 1911 clone in 38 super good round have good supply of ammo,

 

38 Super is indeed a forgotten round and its life has been always in the rear view mirror. It's a dying caliber, it struggles on but been on decline for decades.

I don't like saying that as for over 50 yrs I always wondered about 38 super , it was always around in a 1911 but seemed to be unappreciated for some reasons, I suspect after it came out it was eclipsed by 357 Mag if one wanted more power and back then revolvers were still main stream demand in pistol market.

I converted my 9mm 1911 to 38 Super , curiosity of 38 Super was an itch I had to scratch. I like 38 Super, I like way better than 9mm and if I were to want less than a 45acp for self defense, I'd have a 38 super or .357 SIG 1911 or the dying 40S&W.

I hand load so 38 Super not a issue for ammo and sadly, I don't get much out of 38 Super over 9mm for target shooting purposes. Cost same to reload if you can find the brass so its not cost that detracts from 38 Super.

Why 38 Super did not catch in this country is a good mystery, it deserves a better fate and if I were King for a Day, reverse how things came about, 38 Super would be the caliber du jour today and not 9mm.

At least 38 Super has survived as long as it has, the 40S&W 's demise is at light speed. Its the plague of pistol calibers and if you distill down why.....recoil adversity of todays generation shooters.

and on a parting shot, one of the reasons 9mm prevailed is its a European favorite and they don't view hand guns in the way Americans do, thus anemic calibers 9mm, 32acp, 25acp are chambered for European demand. Europeans don't view hand guns as offensive weapons. Pistols historically to Americans are offensive weapons, not ornaments worn on belts to perhaps defend one's self .

Give a pistol to an American and he/she is not on defense ...well that was the case till the 90's for most pistol owners.

BIg Shout Out to Steel Challenge and other action shooting pistol events where shooters shoot offensively and aggressively. They have the right mind set so there is hope for some of the current generation. Hope their example reverses this trend to passive mindset about handguns nothing more than a defense weapon.

 

Being in Texas we see a lot fro Mexico and it's a big deal there since .45 and 9mm are considered "military rounds" and illegal. Very popular with the cartels.

 

Sorry for the confusion... none on shelves means like the 9mm found locally on a shelf.

 

I had questions on this cartridge. Additionally, I couldn't see buying a larger frame pistol, designed for the .38 Super, but chambered for 9mm. Also, i still was concerned with the tapered case 9mm Luger's reliabilty in the 1911 frame. I had a chance to buy the Colt Competition in .38 Super from an on-line source, so I took it. I've been enjoying the .38 Super in my Colt since that time.

 

We had a local shop that also was a distributor, and he sold a lot of Colts. When Colt went to the Series '80 guns, he closed out a bunch of .38 Supers (early 1980s), I saw he had some for, IIRC, $299. I grabbed one up, did some tinkering (sights, Barsto barrel, a beavertail, etc.) and have been shooting Supers ever since. I like them a lot. Then I sold that Super to a buddy, and went 'without' for awhile. About two or three years ago, another buddy wanted to show off his new Colt Super, and insisted that I shoot it. That did it, I had to get another one. Colt was "in between" runs at that time, so I bought a Springfield RO 9mm and another Barsto, and presto! another Super. Colt turned loose some Supers about that time, so I bought one of those, too. Then, I bought a couple more 9mm Springfields and more barrels.
If you're keeping count, that's four, now. Yeah, I like Supers a bunch.

 

 

How much velocity do you lose with the 4-4.25" barrel?

BTW, nice Commander! Is it all steel or aluminum frame? I'd love to own a Lightweight Commander in .38 Super - in the early 80's I owned a Gov't model, and all I did to it was put better/taller fixed sights on it and slick up the internals. I had an extensively "gunsmithed" Gold Cup in .45, and danged if that Super would shoot with it at a fraction of the cost. If you get a .38 Super that doesn't shoot well, there's something wrong with the gun or the ammo.

The Super is great for ... "creative" reloaders, you can really wring it out and get it very close to a .357 SIG, or a .357 RemMag. I doubt that the "target" can tell the difference in the three.

 

I think 38 super might be the perfect round. But a 1911 doesn't hold 20 rounds and it makes for a heavy gun. For guns to be accepted these days it has to be a never have to load a second magazine and has absolutely no recoil. I am surprised competition shooting hasn't gone to 22cal with a compensator.

 

I have a RIA in the caliber and love it. I reload, so it's easy to get ammo, and I use Super Comp brass. Never was much of a 9mm fan, but the Super shoots well from a 1911, which the Super was developed for.

 

 

A wonderful gift from my loving wife...

 

30’s not 39 but proberly then alson

 

Been shooting 38 super for decades.
No centerfire handgun ammo is as cheap as 9mm. Most LGS around here stock 38 super routinely. Am a handloader, so that helps too.

Shoot a stainless Colt Competetion alot.

Unsung offering :
Tanfoglio (of Italy) makes a very nice CZ75 clone in 38 super. Full size, metal frame. MEC-GAR double stack magazines that hold 17 are stock. Far easier to load than most anything from glock. Flawless operation. Soft, smooth, and extremely accurate.

Everybody at range wants to try my 38 supers. All are impressed.

 

An additional note on 38Super & 9x23Win is wise to use a barrel with a fully supported chamber especially if loading "warm" because as TheTinMan noted Winchester no longer provides their thicker-walled cases. I "believe" the older 38Super barrels were unsupported, limiting their pressure capability. I use Starline Comp in both calibers in supported chambers.

 

I have three of them. I think that it is a really good round for self defense. I find myself a bit surprised that it is not more popular. It appears that some of the semi custom makers have dropped them from their lineup due to this. I consider myself lucky that I was able to get my Ed Brown Executive target in .38 super as Ed Brown is one of the makers that no longer offers it.

 

And thats funny because my name is Ed Brown lol, I called them and they claimed they had a hard time selling them which i find hard to believer because I sure as hell haven't been able to find any used Ed Browns either. And I sure as hell wouldn't pay his prices for one in 9mm. My other interest is the 45 super. do you have any experience with that round? On paper anyway its seems to have some crazy balistics, but have been told its really hard on frames.

 

Wilson, Ed Brown & Alchemy have all discontinued the 38 super option.

 

This is my understanding as well. Interestingly enough I have been considering sending my Les Baer Custom carry in .38 Super out on consignment with my local guy that has moved a lot of guns over the years. He told me that he has sold very few guns chambered in. 38 Super auto over the years.

 

My Regulator stays with the .38s barrel in it. Once I shot 9mm and then 38s back to back I knew which I liked better.

 

And I know I want to build a dedicated .38s lw commander, bobtail. Another project.

 

...that's an easy... Dan Wesson Guardian and you don't have to build anything... A cheaper way to go is a Tisas Stingray in 9mm and over on ebay there are Para/Clark barrels for $112.00 that drop right in...only needed a slight tweaking of the extractor and it shoots as nice as the DW at 1/3 the price...

#1 reason that the Super was never popular is it well deserved reputation of having mediocre accuracy... By using the headpsace on the case rim originally used in the 1903 Colt in the new 1911s SUPER .38s instead of using the .45 ACP headspace on the case mouth really hurt the rounds reputation until the 1970s when George Nonte/Irv Stone figured out the problem and all of a sudden Supers were beyond accurate...

My first two Supers were bought a few weeks apart in 1980...an unfired 1969 SUPER .38 and a 1952 Commander. At 50 yards the SUPER .38 ran 3 FOOT patterns...the Commander 18". When the barrels were replaced with BarSto with the same box of ammo the SUPER .38 ran 3" and the Commander 3.5"... I still have both those guns...

Most any 9mm 1911 can be made to run Super with just a barrel/magazine/spring change. I've converted:
Colt Defender
Colt Commander
Kimber Night Patrol
Tisas Stringray
Tisas Carry

...and so can 10mms...
Kimber Stainless Target II
Kimber Campguard
SIG Nightmare Carry (originally .357 SIG, added .38 Super and 10mm barrels)
Kimber Stainless Target Longslide (Fusion barrel)
Para-USA Elite LS Hunter (Fusion barrel)

Have one of the rare S&W 686-7 PC revolvers that is very accurate. Had TK Custom modify cylinders for a S&W 60-10 3", 66-2 3" and 649-2 2" to run Supers with moon clips. What is nice is that because it is a straight wall case it doesn't back of of the chambers like a 9mm will and lock up the cylinder...

And unlike the 9mm, 9x23 or .357 SIG if one reloads the Super will run bullets from 80-180 grains...

..what's not to like...

Bob

 

I haven't forgotten the Super. My first Colt was a new Combat Commander in .38 Super back around '70 or so. I started loading for it soon after. Chamber support in the Colt was not the best, and headspace control on the tiny semi-rim was dismal. The brass available still utilized the old thin .38 ACP type cases. We are fortunate that now days, chambers are cut to headspace on the case mouth, chamber support is much better, and Super brass is thicker in the case head area.

I still load the Super/Super Comp when the mood strikes. I have loaded the 9X23 Win, but found that the Super/Super Comp in well supported chambers can be loaded to equal 9X23 Win. ballistics with no muss, fuss, or drama. I suspect pressures are lower when using the Super/Super Comp cases as they have noticeably more case capacity than the Winchester 9X23 brass.

I attached a picture of sectioned cases from Brad Miller's old website that shows, upper left, how thin that vintage .38 ACP brass is in the case head area compared to some of the brass we have available now.

 

I haven't forgotten the Super. My first Colt was a new Combat Commander in .38 Super back around '70 or so. I started loading for it soon after. Chamber support in the Colt was not the best, and headspace control on the tiny semi-rim was dismal. The brass available still utilized the old thin .38 ACP type cases. We are fortunate that now days, chambers are cut to headspace on the case mouth, chamber support is much better, and Super brass is thicker in the case head area.

I still load the Super/Super Comp when the mood strikes. I have loaded the 9X23 Win, but found that the Super/Super Comp in well supported chambers can be loaded to equal 9X23 Win. ballistics with no muss, fuss, or drama. I suspect pressures are lower when using the Super/Super Comp cases as they have noticeably more case capacity than the Winchester 9X23 brass.

I attached a picture of sectioned cases from Brad Miller's old website that shows, upper left, how thin that vintage .38 ACP brass is in the case head area compared to some of the brass we have available now.
View attachment 709030

I have a question. will they feed hollow points without issue? I know the 45s don't like to but never tried feeding them throught the super

 

This is the last super I found a few years back at a gun show, supposedly it’s one of 500 made in the series and I picked it up for a little under $500 which didn’t seem to bad

 

I'm pretty absentminded and forgetful, but I haven't forgotten the .38 Super.

It's a fine pistol round. It's everything the 9mm is cracked up to be, yet isn't.

I like it!

 

I don't know about the exaggeration of "packing a wicked punch," but, it definitely is a more accurate and powerful cartridge than 9mm. Back in the early 90's I got to shoot a Colt Govt model in .38 Super for the first time, and it was noticeably more accurate than any 9mm or .45 ACP that I had shot. The recoil was mild and I was impressed with the accuracy. I prefer a 10mm for my EDC guns. But, if I was inclined to carry a 9mm, I'd prefer it to be chambered in .38 Super, for the accuracy and for a little more "umph" in the cartridge performance than 9mm.

 

I say wicked because theres very little low end ball out there so almost anything you can get are like buffalo bore and they ride the wire a tad with some of there stuff. And i've seen some almost stupid handloads out there that walk right along in the lower spectrum of 357mag, anyway you look at it though i wouldn't want to get hit by one at 15-1600fps That said 10mm is a big hitter but just like .45 or any heavy recoil round, the average guys accuracy is out the window. Anybody will shoot better when you snatch their 45 and hand them a 9, but just as there were very few Motocross guys in the 80s that could handlle a 65plus horse 230lb bike wide open, in the gun world not a whole lot of guys can empty a 45 on target. In my Dept 10mm was never actually approved but one asshole do nothing commander pulled strings so he could supposedly "test one"" in the field like he'd ever be anywere there was a chance of shooting someone. He just wanted to be the big shot with his 10mm Smith, with a no lie 8" drop swivel as he bald ass was 6'6' a lot of us tried them at the range but it was just too much. honeslty they killed more people with 357s than anything and even today, really not the 10mm is for what? 357s a cheaper way to plant daisys, And still we have the 38 super thing with many an opinion. like anything bone stock nothing is a thrill, but loaded hot a 38 super will anilate someone just like a 10 and with a lot less recoil and a lot of confusion

 

I think it's more of a niche round than a forgotten one. Not everyone reloads, and .38 Super isn't easily available everywhere. I don't think I've ever seen it for sale in SE Michigan.

 

I just buy them from specialty companies like buffalo bore, Sig actually sells them branded as sig

 

My first choice of a 1911 for a range day is 38 Super by Colt or DW. I kick my tail for overlooking it for years. 38 Super is best enjoyed by reloading as it costs about the same to reload 38 Super as it does to reload 9mm. If Bul ever offers a 1911 in 38 Super I hope to be at the head of the queue to buy one.

If I could still carry a 1911 concealed, it would be chambered in 38 Super.