So what does the quote from the Sight mean when it says that these were hard slides for Army National Match pistols? Is this fellows information incorrect? Is he saying it's a match grade slide but not a National Match slide?

Regards,
Sam

 

.

 

Ben....

Thanks for the heads up about that particular website. Sorry to have passed his info along.

Regards,
Sam

 

Ben's comment that the information on the website:
http://www.sightm1911.com/lib/history/nm.htm
is incorrect is perhaps the understatement of the year. The article is so full of mistakes and misleading generalizations that it should bear the warning label: "For Entertainment Purposes Only." Once again we see proof that "Anything is easy when you don't know what you are talking about". Best Karl

 

The bad news about that website is that it has errors. The good news is that the webmaster is willing to correct the mistakes if you point them out. He is not a collector, per se, especially of GI guns. IIRC he is a shooter/competitor of more modern .45's. Much of his info comes out of early reference books (e.g. Bady) so he is repeating their errors.

 

hi again. a friend has a 779 slide which he showed me. we pored over this thread to confirm veracity. however, we didnt find the rockwell hardness test dots and the TZ.

it had the 7790314 on the left side and strangely, a 55397 on the right side (just a little below the ejection port).

could this slide be a part of the second run of 779 slides samcoltfan earlier mentioned?

your insights and advice will be most appreciated. TIA.

 

Ok, here's my 2 cents on the subject.
The government contracted other vendors besides Colt to make these slides, one being Ralph Esterbrook in Derby Vermont, if my memory serves me well. Rumor has it he was making them on subcontract for a New York firm in the early 80s..
These slides were machined on soft forgings and were heat treated by wiring 2 parts together to minimize warping. The rockwell on these slides were actually too hard, I believe somewhere around RC 50.

There's more.. I just looked up the Rock Island Arsenal blueprint of March 1960 that we use as a standard. The assigned part No. is 7790314.


EDIT
I guess this is old news. I know the Esterbrook slides were NM and did carry a #, but it probably wasn't the 779#

 

779's

From Eng. Drawings.-Springfield 11Mar60,barrel 7790313 mrkd.on top chamber 45 Auto NM 7790313,with ser#under this/Bushing 7267718,ser# on rt.side.---Rear sigt 15Nov56,7268317(new design work use 7791203 or 771464.---RIA 23 Oct 56,Ft.sight 728316-Link 6Apr61, 7790893---Trigger 11Nov60,Long 7791047 w/adjtg screw 7791069--Short 7791068 w/screw 7791070---
RIA 11mar60, Slide(bare) 7790314--as an assembly using new r.sight 5013196 & f.sight 5013197 the slide# becomes 779353.(also,this slide has a flat milled on it for the front sight).

The number on right side of slide is Manufacturer's I.D.

Hardening for slide 7790314--1540 to 1580 deg.F-oil quench-austenite grain size #5 or finer--spec. QQ-5-624.
Safety /Slide stop/Disassembly notches and dust cover hardened to Rockwell 40 to 46.

I may not be right,but it looks like these are Nat.Match updates up to the year of 1961.

 

Link to page with SA NM part configurations

I have a whole section on my site about the SA NM guns and thier configurations by year.

http://www.coolgunsite.com/collectors_guide.htm#National Match Pistols (Springfield Armory 1955-1965)

CHeers
Ty

 

STUMPY, can you provide more infor for:

"The number on right side of slide is Manufacturer's I.D."

This is another area of seemingly endless speculation/confusion.

 

Slide Manuf. I.D.

Engineering drawing only shows location measurement spec's,does not identify any manufacturers.

Does anyone know anything about a site called

www.rayvigator.com ?

I got on this site the other day and by chance scrolled down to a site called NARA. this is some kind of Nat. Archives site, I brought up a whole bunch of lists of letters and corespondence between the Springfield Armory (internal) and to contractors about all kinds of stuff. It's such a big list that I haven't had time to get back into it and try reading any of the letters,etc; I have an old slow computer. You might really want to look into this site just to see what you can find. Just might get a surprise.

Stumpy

 

Heres somemore info on CAGE codes for contract slides.

00-876-4033 SLIDE,AUTOMATIC PISTOL

PROCUREMENT - Procurement History
Contract # CLIN CAGE Source Date Unit Price Quantity Total Price
DAAA0993C0406 0001AB 3W544 AMCCOM May 27, 1993 $0.0000 0 $0.00
DAAA0993C0406 0001AB 3W544 AMCCOM May 27, 1993 $93.5000 2107 $197,004.50
DAAA0990C0597 0001AB 32067 AMCCOM May 1, 1990 $97.6679 7794 $761,223.61
DAAA0990C0597 0001AB 32067 AMCCOM May 1, 1990 $97.7000 7794 $761,473.80
DAAA0985C0407 0001AB 6K223 AMCCOM Feb 1, 1985 $53.8031 14300 $769,384.33
DAAA0984C0695 0001AB S3140 CCOM Jun 1, 1984 $58.9100 18500 $1,089,835.00
DAAA0984C0210 0001AB 16447 AMCCOM May 1, 1984 $62.0031 453 $28,087.40
DAAA0984C0210 0001AC 16447 AMCCOM May 1, 1984 $59.7402 7973 $476,308.61
DAAA0984C0210 0001AD 16447 AMCCOM May 1, 1984 $59.7403 6268 $374,452.20
DAAA0984C0210 0001AE 16447 AMCCOM May 1, 1984 $59.7401 2053 $122,646.43
DAAA0984C0185 0001AB 2U894 AMCCOM Jan 1, 1984 $79.0393 18107 $1,431,164.61
DAAA0984C0185 0001AB 2U894 AMCCOM Jan 1, 1984 $79.1600 18107 $1,433,350.12
DAAA0981C4312 0001AB 53397 CCOM Jan 1, 1981 $68.6456 26036 $1,787,256.84
DAAA0981C4312 0001AC 53397 CCOM Jan 1, 1981 $67.1747 2421 $162,629.95

PROCUREMENT - Related CAGE Information
CAGE Status Company Name City and State
3W544 A LEWIS MACHINE AND TOOL CO MILAN, IL 61264
32067 A MARVIN ENGINEERING CO INC INGLEWOOD, CA 90302-2903
6K223 Y L A R MFG INC WEST JORDAN, UT 84084-4997
S3140 A ISRAELI MILITARY INDUSTRIES TEL AVIV NONE
16447 P MILO COMPONENTS INC FREEPORT, NY 11520-4612
2U894 A DSE INC VENICE, FL 34292
53397 A NUMAX ELECTRONICS INC NEW YORK, NY 10118-0110

Here is a .45 I built with an Olympic Arms frame and a contract slide from Numax Electronics..

[

 

N.M.

Anyone looking for a N.M. ? Check this one out.

www.gunbroker.com/auction/ViewItem.asp?Item=6026540


Stumpy

 

Ken-maybe it's a Texas thing- I have a NM/Essex hybrid that i bought out of TX a few years ago, also extremely accurate if not real pretty (it's been dubbed the Frankenmatch).

The slide is marked NM7791435, has the angled serrations like the Drake, a Kensight adjustable rear, and the right side is marked MFR 5T083.

Any ideas about who made it?

 

Ken-maybe it's a Texas thing- I have a NM/Essex hybrid that i bought out of TX a few years ago, also extremely accurate if not real pretty (it's been dubbed the Frankenmatch).

The slide is marked NM7791435, has the angled serrations like the Drake, a Kensight adjustable rear, and the right side is marked MFR 5T083.

Any ideas about who made it?

Cage ID 5T083 5T083
Cage Name NUCAM INC
Cage Address 26055-H EMERY RD

City, State WARRENSVILLE HEIGHTS OH
44128-5728
Country

Phone 216-831-6970
SIC 3599
CAO S3603A

Date Entered 81304
Date Changed

Cage Replace


HTH,
Jeff

 

Another mystery solved! My thanks to Jeff and everyone.

Dan

 

Well ain't I glad I ran into this thread. Had the gun bug last Fri. so off to Kiesler's I go with every intention of buying one of the new repro Series 70 Colts. Got teary eyed when I saw they had raised the price on them to $899, no way Jose. Gotta get something, noticed an Essex that had been there for months, $299, chopped them to $225, it has a 7790314 slide with an M stamped between the rear sight and ejection port, right side is stamped MFR 2U894 and I could only find one rockwell dimple. Barrel is chrome lined with hood markings of
.45 AUTO
7791193
85
there is also an M stamped on the lugs.
Took it home to test fire before detail stripping and cleaning, killed an anti freeze jug, 2.5" groups offhand at 25' which delighted me cuz I figured it to be a real mutt but couldn't say no because of the price. It came with one of those awful looking barrel bushing/compensator thingys on it which is probably why it hadn't sold earlier. After stripping and cleaning I changed out the barrel and comp bushing, with a 70 series barrel and collett bushing I had hard chromed and never used, went after another anti freeze jug and wowza, less than 2" groups at 25'.
Not meaning to rant but what a buy, whomever built this pistol did a very good job, no complaints on the Essex frame at all, came with an arched steel ms housing w/lanyard loop, really short curved/checkered trigger and black plastic checkered grips, gun is easily 98%, not a mark on it. The only thing I will do is try to reduce the trigger pull which feels like 50 pounds right now.
Anyone know who manufacturer 2U894 is??
Thanks for letting me rant, just excited to get another 1911 in the safe.

 

More Nat.Match Info.

This thread really got me tweeked,had Eng.Drawings for years. Never looked at details of same.Dug out & looked at "trees" instead of the "Forest". In one of the replys someone said they only knew of 2 parts with I.D.#'s(brl/bushing) I thought that also,BUT, the barrel link for the N.M. also has I.D.# stamped on it(1/16" high),does not state #,just location for it. Also found,Link Part#7790893 holes already finished, #7267771 has "X" undersized holes for fitting during pistol work up(both carry ID stamp. Think #7790893 is something like the #13 we use for build up).Except #7267771,all internal parts lists "F"# individual to NM,1911A1,etc; all carry same order #.Think you have to ref. "F"# accord. to pistol involved. Most interesting thing on internal parts is heat treatmnt spec's, etc; The Ejector alone has 3 diff. heat treat.zones ea. w/ diff. hardnesses,what an amazing feat of engineering the 1911/ 1911A1 is.(I wonder if anyone ever tried to Patent J.M. Browning's brain)?

Stumpy

 

Well ain't I glad I ran into this thread. Anyone know who manufacturer 2U894 is??
Thanks for letting me rant, just excited to get another 1911 in the safe.

Cage ID 2U894 2U894
Cage Name BALIMOY MFG INC
Cage Address 216 SEABOARD AVE
P O BOX 1268
City, State VENICE FL
33595-2306
Country

Phone 813-484-9594
SIC 3469
CAO S1109A

Date Entered 80287
Date Changed

HTH
Jeff