I carry a Kimber Ultra II 1911,,,what is the best performing self defense ammo for this short barrel? My thinking process is that faster lighter bullets, such as the 185 grain DRTs might be best...Does anyone know of any good YouTube videos on it or articles?
Best performing 45 ACP for self-defense
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Ammo08
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Sir, In my experience with these shorty 1911's two things are constant: Not all magazines function reliably and not all ammo functions reliably. Not an issue on the range but if self defense is the mission of the shorty 1911, its got to function . Matters not what the bullet is ..SWC, FP, HP, or whatever, the issue is reliable function. If you find ammo that has both reliable function in the flavor of bullet design you desire, then you have a touch down. Finding magazines that function is pretty cut & dry but ammo isn't. It isn't the first shot that is in question, its the follow up shot (if required) that is paramount concern and that mag better fed that bullet of choice perfectly. The shorty 1911 pistols can be problematic on ammo and magazines, good luck finding what is best for your use.
I will digress on caliber. I often hear 9mm advocates claim todays better bullet designs and powders make 9mm as good or better than 45 Acp . (I guess that means 40 S&W as well). H mmmmm so if newer bullet design and newer powders do that for 9mm, what great things do they do for 45acp and 40 S&W? So these improved 45acp & 40 S&W are how much better than 9mm using that rationale ? Well, I don't know the answer so pick the caliber you trust and make sure your mags and ammo function in your shorty 1911 (or whatever pistol you trust), and turn the page.
I will digress on caliber. I often hear 9mm advocates claim todays better bullet designs and powders make 9mm as good or better than 45 Acp . (I guess that means 40 S&W as well). H mmmmm so if newer bullet design and newer powders do that for 9mm, what great things do they do for 45acp and 40 S&W? So these improved 45acp & 40 S&W are how much better than 9mm using that rationale ? Well, I don't know the answer so pick the caliber you trust and make sure your mags and ammo function in your shorty 1911 (or whatever pistol you trust), and turn the page.
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My preferred 45 SD round is 230 Grain Federal HST. It expands to .9" or better in the tests I've read about over the years. I use it in my 4" and 5" 1911's and my 4.2 inch PPQ...The only 45 I do not use it in is my XDs which is 3.3 inches because with HST it has a little to much recoil. So in the XDs I use 185 gr Golden saber, which expands to .7" or maybe a little less from the results I've read about over the years.
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I've not had a problem with hp cycling or chambering in my full or commander size 1911s (not fired the shorter officer's size or kimber/other equivalents) But with .45 I wonder how much benefit they (hp ammo) give on the receiving end? In 9mm it makes sense in terms of the idea is the bullet expands, because the 9x19 is both lighter and skinnier in reference to the .45 acp, but the .45 is already quite large. I mean, you can fit a 9mm case into a .45 case. And the 230 grain .45 acp was meant to replicate the .45 colt, which was intended to be able to stop a charging horse.
So part of me wonders if the main practical benefit of hollow point or expanding rounds in .45 acp are 1) reduced risk of over penetration and therefore risk to the public if one must defend himself outside his own property on the street or in a public place, or 2) selling us more costly ammo with cool graphics on the package?
I will say, however, hp .45 takes impressive chunks out of the dirt berm on my range!
Still, I would not feel under-armed if I had to use ball ammo in my .45.
So part of me wonders if the main practical benefit of hollow point or expanding rounds in .45 acp are 1) reduced risk of over penetration and therefore risk to the public if one must defend himself outside his own property on the street or in a public place, or 2) selling us more costly ammo with cool graphics on the package?
I will say, however, hp .45 takes impressive chunks out of the dirt berm on my range!
Still, I would not feel under-armed if I had to use ball ammo in my .45.
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this is just my $0.02 - , but, as others have said, pick the ammo that runs in your gun 100% and you can hit with - if you hit the BG with a head shot he isn't going to be asking, was that a 185 or a 230? - Torso shots are not 1 stop shots - add adrenaline and who knows what drugs and humans can live a surprisingly long time while bleeding out.
JAG
JAG
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Now, Now…..a Gold Dot launched from the 38 Special with SR4756 as a propellant will stick those porcupine quills in the tree house!!😆
I think that it is important to consider that we have all heard the stories of the drugged up perp that soaked up dozens of slugs from whatever and kept coming. But in the vast majority of cases how often does this really happen? First of all, just displaying a gun will usually end things. Ask me how I know this. Secondly a well placed shot from about anything will go on to end just about anything that a display will not. What I draw from this is that level of skill and training is the real key. As has already been stated here a hit with a .22 rimfire goes a lot farther than a miss with a .45 to being a show stopper.
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How did this thread become a "caliber war", all the OP wanted to know was advice on different 45 Bullet weights and velocity for 45. See, I mentioned 45 twice lol.
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I've used Sierra 185 jhp ( 18 ish a box 20) in all of my 45s.Zero issues,granted ive never pulled the specs( like that would change anything) as these were practice only.
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Is the .45’s Stopping Power a Myth? - The Armory Life Just got this Today.Either way if you have a pistol odds help on that. Sure caliber has its peculiar aspect( cost,weight,pistol choice, mag cap). I say Carry what YOU Like!
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All my carry guns are 3" 1911's (Wilson & Kimber), and I've found that Hornady Critical Defense 185gr Flex-Tips give all the penetration and expansion I expect for a SD round.
My test is to line up gallon milk jugs 8-deep and fire into them from 7 yards. This is typical expansion:
As far as penetration is concerned, all bullets stopped in jug #5. Some of the commercial SD HP loads I tested did not open at all.
My test is to line up gallon milk jugs 8-deep and fire into them from 7 yards. This is typical expansion:
As far as penetration is concerned, all bullets stopped in jug #5. Some of the commercial SD HP loads I tested did not open at all.
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All my carry guns are 3" 1911's (Wilson & Kimber), and I've found that Hornady Critical Defense 185gr Flex-Tips give all the penetration and expansion I expect for a SD round.
My test is to line up gallon milk jugs 8-deep and fire into them from 7 yards. This is typical expansion:
As far as penetration is concerned, all bullets stopped in jug #5. Some of the commercial SD HP loads I tested did not open at all.
No bones?
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Reality is, you can watch a bajillion actual defense and police shootings on Youtube (Active Self Protection) and other places on the Interweb, and the 9mm seems to take a mag and a half from several guns to neutralize the typical street hoodlum—can’t recall seeing one, one shot stop in any of the vids I’ve watched!
What I can relate to, is hunting performance with .45 caliber pistols, and early .38/ .357 pistols, and on medium to large, deer sized game, and livestock ( barnyard critters like sheep and goats, to horses), and I’ve never seen a 9mm, 38 Spec, .357 load that would compare to even mild .44 Spec, or .45 ACP?!
What I can relate to, is hunting performance with .45 caliber pistols, and early .38/ .357 pistols, and on medium to large, deer sized game, and livestock ( barnyard critters like sheep and goats, to horses), and I’ve never seen a 9mm, 38 Spec, .357 load that would compare to even mild .44 Spec, or .45 ACP?!
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Another reason I'm not impressed by small center of mass groups. If ya shoot them CoM (X-ring) 10~12 times and they're still coming at ya, try shooting 'em somewhere else!
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Like that expanded bullet!All my carry guns are 3" 1911's (Wilson & Kimber), and I've found that Hornady Critical Defense 185gr Flex-Tips give all the penetration and expansion I expect for a SD round.
My test is to line up gallon milk jugs 8-deep and fire into them from 7 yards. This is typical expansion:
As far as penetration is concerned, all bullets stopped in jug #5. Some of the commercial SD HP loads I tested did not open at all.
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Well here's a rare time I might argue with ya. My friend who bought my old Dan Wesson Pistol-Pac mounted a scope on the 8in barrel and has taken quite a few PA whitetail out to 100yds with plain Federal Am.Eagle 158gr JSP, which were very accurate in that gun. Most of the deer didn't go very far! The few recovered bullets showed serious expansion, though most shed their jackets.
I wouldn't even attempt 25yd, let alone a 75yd shot on a deer with a .45 ACP.
A .44 Special with Keith-loads
maybe, depending on the revolver used.
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Don’t doubt that at all! When I was a younger fellow, and stationed at 29 Palms, I bought myself a Colt SAA, 2nd Gen in .357 Mag. Loaded 180 Gr XTPs with the intent of deer hunting with it back in Idaho. I used it, and a couple other DA .357 revolvers to hunt called predators in the desert of CA and Idaho, and still have a .357 Ruger Police-Service Six that I’ll probably never part with, but I had better results across the board when I moved up to my first .44 Special, a Colt New Frontier. Been hooked on the .44 plus calibers ever since!Well here's a rare time I might argue with ya. My friend who bought my old Dan Wesson Pistol-Pac mounted a scope on the 8in barrel and has taken quite a few PA whitetail out to 100yds with plain Federal Am.Eagle 158gr JSP, which were very accurate in that gun. Most of the deer didn't go very far! The few recovered bullets showed serious expansion, though most shed their jackets.
I wouldn't even attempt 25yd, let alone a 75yd shot on a deer with a .45 ACP.
A .44 Special with Keith-loads
But seriously Michael how many one shot stops from any round make for a real news story? Think about that. When was the last time that you heard a story about somebody just displaying a firearm, not necessarily "brandishing" one but just displaying one to cool things down. I do not think that I have ever seen a story like this. Blood and drama is what sells. I have pulled twice on people and it really made a difference as in everyone went home. The best possible outcome but hardly a headline story.
Think about the guy that got the Pulitzer prize or some such for the execution shot of that Viet Cong guy in Saigon. How about that shot of that poor Vietnamese girl torched by Napalm. The scenes of GIs helping people never got the coverage that they deserved. You have to think about this stuff.
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I understand, and agree with what you are saying, and I’ve had two encounters where merely being armed, and determined, thwarted a malicious attempt. That .357 Colt SAA, may have been a fine deer hunting tool, under the right circumstances, and I wouldn’t feel exactly unarmed carrying it around in the woods today if I still had it. When I go out in the dark to get firewood, its usually my Police-Service Six in .357 with a bobbed hammer that goes in my coat pocket, and its stoked with 13 grs of H110 under a 173 gr Keith’s. Its certainly nothing to sneeze at, but my field observations have me leaning towards bigger calibers:
Where do you live to need that old hunting round?
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